In my teams we take tickets for meetings, which makes product owners very aware of their impact on delivery. I like including refactoring in tickets, but if th

In my teams we take tickets for meetings, which makes product owners very aware of their impact on delivery. I like including refactoring in tickets, but if the refactor is consequent it's not going to work. It's not so often thankfully, I usually manage to convince the PO of the value of it, then try to not budge once it's decided