3 ms·

Do you have some data on this?

by cujo 7y ago

hwillis 7y ago
It's false[1]; everywhere in the US is 2-4 F warmer than it was prior to 2000. He may have this impression from looking at 2002, which was a particularly warm year. Some parts of the midwest have been cooler than they were in 2002. The general thing about the person he was responding to being totally wrong was obviously correct. [1]: https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/ https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/
- chrisco255 7y ago
  From your link the baseline average is from "relative to 1951-1980 average". Which was the coldest period of the 20th century. It got so cold in the 70s they were predicting an incoming ice age. It's very dishonest and very wrong to cherry pick the coldest modern period of temperature and then say we have increased by 0.8C from there. Climate is cyclical and there are many Multi-decadal Oscillations in oceans that impact global temperature, rainfall patterns, and overall climate conditions. The AMO, the PDO, not to mention ENSO. As far as anamolies go, which area is experiencing "cooler than average" (which, as mentioned above, is difficult to do) depends on the year, but here's a map from NOAA showing 2013 temps and clearly shows the Western U.S. experiencing below average temps (from a 1980-2010 baseline): https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/service/global/map-blended-mntp/201301.gif https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/service/global/map-blended-mn... And to underscore the situation in the 1970s I'm going to link to a documentary that starred Leonard Nemoy as narrator in 1978. Quotes below and link below to clips from: “In Search of…The Coming Ice Age”, narrated by Leonard Nimoy (Spock from Star Trek): “…sea coasts long free of summer ice, are now blocked year round…” “…the data shows temperatures in the arctic have fallen dramatically over the last 30 years…” “…in most locations the drop has been about 2 degrees Centigrade…” https://youtu.be/1kGB5MMIAVA https://youtu.be/1kGB5MMIAVA https://youtu.be/mOC7ePWCHGk https://youtu.be/mOC7ePWCHGk GISS also claims to have global temperature data from 1884 that doesn't exist. They interpolate and make up numbers when they go back that far, as we don't have records from much of Asia, Africa, eastern Europe and south America during that time, even huge swaths of Australia were not covered by temperature gauges. We didn't really start getting quality global temperature data until the satellite era.
  - hwillis 7y ago
    > From your link the baseline [...] by 0.8C from there. You goober, I was comparing the measurements from 2000 onward. You specifically said the past couple decades. The reference point does not matter at all. > As far as anamolies go, which area is experiencing "cooler than average" (which, as mentioned above, is difficult to do) depends on the year, but here's a map from NOAA showing 2013 temps and clearly shows the Western U.S. experiencing below average temps (from a 1980-2010 baseline) You just complained about cherry picking and now you're looking at a single year that was slightly colder. On average, the US is warmer everywhere. > GISS also claims to have global temperature data from 1884 that doesn't exist. They interpolate and make up numbers when they go back that far, as we don't have records from much of Asia, Africa, eastern Europe and south America during that time, even huge swaths of Australia were not covered by temperature gauges. Still irrelevant to the last couple decades. Sue me for trusting NASA though, I guess?
    - chrisco255 7y ago
      I think GISS is not trustworthy. Honestly, they engage in data tampering and manipulation and they're not honest about historical climate data and it's limitations (prior to satellite era). The margin of error for data prior to satellite era is higher than the observed warming in the 20th century. UAH is a good resource (University of Alabama-Huntsville in conjunction with NASA, albeit a different department than GISS) and they show a 0.13C per decade trend since the 80s. That being said, because global temps are not evenly distributed, some areas are experiencing cooler temps and some areas are experiencing warmer temps. Averages hide a lot of nuance. See below for latest chart from UAH: http://www.drroyspencer.com/2020/01/uah-global-temperature-update-for-december-2019-0-56-deg-c/ http://www.drroyspencer.com/2020/01/uah-global-temperature-u...
      - hwillis 7y ago
        Fuck off. Roy Spencer is an Evangelical creationist who wrote a book about evolution being wrong. He believes humans have no affect on global warming and that more CO2 in the atmosphere is a good thing: https://skepticalscience.com/skeptic_Roy_Spencer.htm https://skepticalscience.com/skeptic_Roy_Spencer.htm https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Roy_Spencer https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Roy_Spencer His own satellite work has been retracted and refuted: https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/blogs/climateqa/have-satellites-actually-observed-cooling/ https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/blogs/climateqa/have-satel... He's a bad scientist who cares far more about his own politics than accurate research.

Do you have some data on this?

by cujo 7y ago

Do you have some data on this?

It's false[1]; everywhere in the US is 2-4 F warmer than it was prior to 2000. He may have this impression from looking at 2002, which was a particularly warm year. Some parts of the midwest have been cooler than they were in 2002. The general thing about the person he was responding to being totally wrong was obviously correct. [1]: https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/ https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/

chrisco255 7y ago
From your link the baseline average is from "relative to 1951-1980 average". Which was the coldest period of the 20th century. It got so cold in the 70s they were predicting an incoming ice age. It's very dishonest and very wrong to cherry pick the coldest modern period of temperature and then say we have increased by 0.8C from there. Climate is cyclical and there are many Multi-decadal Oscillations in oceans that impact global temperature, rainfall patterns, and overall climate conditions. The AMO, the PDO, not to mention ENSO. As far as anamolies go, which area is experiencing "cooler than average" (which, as mentioned above, is difficult to do) depends on the year, but here's a map from NOAA showing 2013 temps and clearly shows the Western U.S. experiencing below average temps (from a 1980-2010 baseline): https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/service/global/map-blended-mntp/201301.gif https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/service/global/map-blended-mn... And to underscore the situation in the 1970s I'm going to link to a documentary that starred Leonard Nemoy as narrator in 1978. Quotes below and link below to clips from: “In Search of…The Coming Ice Age”, narrated by Leonard Nimoy (Spock from Star Trek): “…sea coasts long free of summer ice, are now blocked year round…” “…the data shows temperatures in the arctic have fallen dramatically over the last 30 years…” “…in most locations the drop has been about 2 degrees Centigrade…” https://youtu.be/1kGB5MMIAVA https://youtu.be/1kGB5MMIAVA https://youtu.be/mOC7ePWCHGk https://youtu.be/mOC7ePWCHGk GISS also claims to have global temperature data from 1884 that doesn't exist. They interpolate and make up numbers when they go back that far, as we don't have records from much of Asia, Africa, eastern Europe and south America during that time, even huge swaths of Australia were not covered by temperature gauges. We didn't really start getting quality global temperature data until the satellite era.
- hwillis 7y ago
  > From your link the baseline [...] by 0.8C from there. You goober, I was comparing the measurements from 2000 onward. You specifically said the past couple decades. The reference point does not matter at all. > As far as anamolies go, which area is experiencing "cooler than average" (which, as mentioned above, is difficult to do) depends on the year, but here's a map from NOAA showing 2013 temps and clearly shows the Western U.S. experiencing below average temps (from a 1980-2010 baseline) You just complained about cherry picking and now you're looking at a single year that was slightly colder. On average, the US is warmer everywhere. > GISS also claims to have global temperature data from 1884 that doesn't exist. They interpolate and make up numbers when they go back that far, as we don't have records from much of Asia, Africa, eastern Europe and south America during that time, even huge swaths of Australia were not covered by temperature gauges. Still irrelevant to the last couple decades. Sue me for trusting NASA though, I guess?
  - chrisco255 7y ago
    I think GISS is not trustworthy. Honestly, they engage in data tampering and manipulation and they're not honest about historical climate data and it's limitations (prior to satellite era). The margin of error for data prior to satellite era is higher than the observed warming in the 20th century. UAH is a good resource (University of Alabama-Huntsville in conjunction with NASA, albeit a different department than GISS) and they show a 0.13C per decade trend since the 80s. That being said, because global temps are not evenly distributed, some areas are experiencing cooler temps and some areas are experiencing warmer temps. Averages hide a lot of nuance. See below for latest chart from UAH: http://www.drroyspencer.com/2020/01/uah-global-temperature-update-for-december-2019-0-56-deg-c/ http://www.drroyspencer.com/2020/01/uah-global-temperature-u...
    - hwillis 7y ago
      Fuck off. Roy Spencer is an Evangelical creationist who wrote a book about evolution being wrong. He believes humans have no affect on global warming and that more CO2 in the atmosphere is a good thing: https://skepticalscience.com/skeptic_Roy_Spencer.htm https://skepticalscience.com/skeptic_Roy_Spencer.htm https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Roy_Spencer https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Roy_Spencer His own satellite work has been retracted and refuted: https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/blogs/climateqa/have-satellites-actually-observed-cooling/ https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/blogs/climateqa/have-satel... He's a bad scientist who cares far more about his own politics than accurate research.