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Parts of this are commonplace: "Fifty-seven percent of respondents worry about losing the respect and dignity they once enjoyed in their country." Sure. Decis

Parts of this are commonplace: "Fifty-seven percent of respondents worry about losing the respect and dignity they once enjoyed in their country." Sure. Decisions are made top-down, expertise is discounted, etc. The culture has drifted. But then this frightening (to me) non-sequitur (to me): "Fifty-six per cent of the surveyed global population said capitalism in its current form does more harm than good in the world." Based on available data, abandoning capitalism makes all these problems much worse, plus overshadows them with questions of basic survival.

helen___keller 7y ago
Framing it as a dichotomy isn't particularly helpful here. "Capitalism in its current form" is the key phrase here - this includes crony capitalism, environmental devastation, disgusting levels of inequality, and sometimes even a total disregard for human life and health. (All depending on the country in question of course) A state run economy isn't necessary to fix these. It's possible to believe that capitalism does more harm than good, right now, and that the system can be fixed while remaining capitalistic
- tom-thistime 7y ago
  "the system can be fixed while remaining capitalistic" If that's what people are talking about, great. I'm not frightened of whatever Scandinavia is doing. I'm not frightened of the New Deal.
  - helen___keller 7y ago
    I could be wrong but that's what I assume people are moving in favor for. I haven't seen any evidence that tankies are more than just a tiny minority on the internet, but I would be equally terrified to see the future they would impose.
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thomascgalvin 7y ago
It would be more accurate to say unfettered capitalism does more harm than good. I don't think most people want to grow a gnarly beard, take up hammer and sickle, and overthrow the bourgeois. People generally like the fact that Apple releases a new iPhone with a better camera every year, and that Gmail reminds them of that doctor's appointment they scheduled six months ago. What they don't like is that the benefits of automation and increased productivity are going almost exclusively to the one percent. What they don't like is that a college degree is now minimal criteria for jobs that logically should not require one, and that the cost of that degree consumes the supposed salary benefits of having one. What they don't like is the fact that we're watching our ecosystem collapse in real time, and massive polluters tell us that it's our fault for using plastic straws. People aren't calling for a switch to Soviet-style communism, they're asking for their agency back. They want to be paid wages that are fair, wages that allow them to pay the rent and put food on the table. They want to be able to retire, and they don't want to have to become Wall Street savants in order to achieve that goal. They want to be able to have their health needs taken care of without bankrupting themselves and their family. Capitalism has made great contributions to our way of life. But unfettered capitalism, or worse, capitalism where the incumbents are protected by legislation, are syphoning off all of the value in our economy, leaving nothing for the everyday person. That cannot continue.
- tsycho 7y ago
  I understand your intent, but what people "want" reads like an utopian wishlist. It's not clear that any strategy sustainably can take us there. All regulations are tweaks to free market capitalism, and more are definitely needed. But do you think that the masses that are rallying up behind authoritarian governments around the world are taking a view as nuanced as yours? I fear they are not.
  - thomascgalvin 7y ago
    Fair wages, health care, and stable retirement are a utopian wishlist now?
- magduf 7y ago
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helen___keller 7y ago

Framing it as a dichotomy isn't particularly helpful here. "Capitalism in its current form" is the key phrase here - this includes crony capitalism, environmental devastation, disgusting levels of inequality, and sometimes even a total disregard for human life and health. (All depending on the country in question of course) A state run economy isn't necessary to fix these. It's possible to believe that capitalism does more harm than good, right now, and that the system can be fixed while remaining capitalistic

tom-thistime 7y ago
"the system can be fixed while remaining capitalistic" If that's what people are talking about, great. I'm not frightened of whatever Scandinavia is doing. I'm not frightened of the New Deal.
- helen___keller 7y ago
  I could be wrong but that's what I assume people are moving in favor for. I haven't seen any evidence that tankies are more than just a tiny minority on the internet, but I would be equally terrified to see the future they would impose.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]

thomascgalvin 7y ago

It would be more accurate to say unfettered capitalism does more harm than good. I don't think most people want to grow a gnarly beard, take up hammer and sickle, and overthrow the bourgeois. People generally like the fact that Apple releases a new iPhone with a better camera every year, and that Gmail reminds them of that doctor's appointment they scheduled six months ago. What they don't like is that the benefits of automation and increased productivity are going almost exclusively to the one percent. What they don't like is that a college degree is now minimal criteria for jobs that logically should not require one, and that the cost of that degree consumes the supposed salary benefits of having one. What they don't like is the fact that we're watching our ecosystem collapse in real time, and massive polluters tell us that it's our fault for using plastic straws. People aren't calling for a switch to Soviet-style communism, they're asking for their agency back. They want to be paid wages that are fair, wages that allow them to pay the rent and put food on the table. They want to be able to retire, and they don't want to have to become Wall Street savants in order to achieve that goal. They want to be able to have their health needs taken care of without bankrupting themselves and their family. Capitalism has made great contributions to our way of life. But unfettered capitalism, or worse, capitalism where the incumbents are protected by legislation, are syphoning off all of the value in our economy, leaving nothing for the everyday person. That cannot continue.

tsycho 7y ago
I understand your intent, but what people "want" reads like an utopian wishlist. It's not clear that any strategy sustainably can take us there. All regulations are tweaks to free market capitalism, and more are definitely needed. But do you think that the masses that are rallying up behind authoritarian governments around the world are taking a view as nuanced as yours? I fear they are not.
- thomascgalvin 7y ago
  Fair wages, health care, and stable retirement are a utopian wishlist now?
magduf 7y ago

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