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Why the assumption of left or right, when at least in the US most people identify as independents? And to be even more fair, you aren’t talking about “people”

Why the assumption of left or right, when at least in the US most people identify as independents? And to be even more fair, you aren’t talking about “people” here but the OP who can clearly state their own personal preferences, without the need for you to construct a theory of hidden bias.

leereeves 7y ago
No, I'm not only talking about the OP here. Look up the story I'm talking about and you'll see that it was ignored by left-wing sources: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=cnn+edited+video+of+sister&t=ffab&atb=v63-1&ia=web https://duckduckgo.com/?q=cnn+edited+video+of+sister&t=ffab&... https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=cnn%20edited%20video%20of%20sister https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=cnn%20edited%20video%2... The entire media establishment ignores these tactics when used by other organizations they agree with.
wozniacki 7y ago
Why the assumption of left or right, when at least in the US most people identify as independents? Do you wish to cite a source for this or do you wish to gaslight here? Voters declaring themselves as independent of a major political party rose nationally by 6 percentage points to 28 percent of the U.S. electorate between 2000 and last year’s congressional midterm contest in states with party registration, analyst Rhodes Cook wrote in Sabato’s Crystal Ball political newsletter at the University of Virginia Center for Politics. But as few as 19 percent of Americans identifying as independent truly have no leaning to a party, according to the Pew Research Center.[1] [1] 'Difference-maker' independent voters in U.S. presidential election crosshairs https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-deciders-independents/difference-maker-independent-voters-in-u-s-presidential-election-crosshairs-idUSKCN1VK128 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-deciders-ind...
- true_religion 7y ago
  The pew polling numbers posted higher in the thread are a fine source. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/15/facts-about-us-political-independents/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/15/facts-about... The gist of it is that for any given party, more people are not members of it (e.g. 70%+ of Americans are not Democrats) so you are not safe in guessing someone political affiliations. Stats wise, you will likely be wrong. Secondarily, saying that someone who leans to a party is basically in that party is wrong. For example, I am an independent. I lean republican on the local level, but in the Federal elections I lean Democrat. If you polled me, I would say I lean republican since that’s usually what’s on my mind
dragonwriter 7y ago
> Why the assumption of left or right, when at least in the US most people identify as independents? Most people don’t identify as independents, and, anyhow, studies of voting behavior show that most independents have a clear party leaning between the two major parties and are just as consistently attached to the party they lean toward as people who identify with the party. So not only is it the case that most people don't identify as independents, most of those who do aren't distinguishable from self-identified partisans when it comes to voting behavior.
- arminiusreturns 7y ago
  On the contrary, according to relatively recent Pew numbers from 2018 [1], around ~38% of American's identify as independents, with ~%31 democrat and ~%26 republican. To be fair many of them lean towards one party or another (your last point acknowledged), but independents are much more important in politics than they are usually given credit for. [1] https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/15/facts-about-us-political-independents/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/15/facts-about...
  - dragonwriter 7y ago
    > On the contrary, according to relatively recent Pew numbers from 2018 [1], around ~38% of American's identify as independents, with ~%31 democrat and ~%26 republican. That's not “on the contrary”; 38% < 50%; most Americans don't identify as independents. Heck, even 43% (the number that don't identify as either Republicans or Democrats) is less than 50%; most Americans specifically identify as either Democrats or Republicans. > but independents are much more important in politics than they are usually given credit for. On the contrary, independents are given outsize importance by the major media, because they are treated as just as large of a group as they actually are, but are treated as if their voting behavior was much more different from that of self-identified partisans than it actually is.
    - arminiusreturns 7y ago
      You got me in a technically correct way, which is as they say, the best kind of correct. I think the keyword "majority" being defined as more than %50 being the crux, so I should have worded my statement better with a "most", "plurality" or "relative majority" instead. > most Americans specifically identify as either Democrats or Republicans Now you just did the same thing I did but in reverse! See my comments about more specific words for plurality such as "most". > independents are given outsize importance by the major media I don't think independents are given much importance at all by the major media, but I have increasingly disconnected from that circus too so I might not be a good judge of it.

leereeves 7y ago

No, I'm not only talking about the OP here. Look up the story I'm talking about and you'll see that it was ignored by left-wing sources: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=cnn+edited+video+of+sister&t=ffab&atb=v63-1&ia=web https://duckduckgo.com/?q=cnn+edited+video+of+sister&t=ffab&... https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=cnn%20edited%20video%20of%20sister https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=cnn%20edited%20video%2... The entire media establishment ignores these tactics when used by other organizations they agree with.

wozniacki 7y ago

Why the assumption of left or right, when at least in the US most people identify as independents? Do you wish to cite a source for this or do you wish to gaslight here? Voters declaring themselves as independent of a major political party rose nationally by 6 percentage points to 28 percent of the U.S. electorate between 2000 and last year’s congressional midterm contest in states with party registration, analyst Rhodes Cook wrote in Sabato’s Crystal Ball political newsletter at the University of Virginia Center for Politics. But as few as 19 percent of Americans identifying as independent truly have no leaning to a party, according to the Pew Research Center.[1] [1] 'Difference-maker' independent voters in U.S. presidential election crosshairs https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-deciders-independents/difference-maker-independent-voters-in-u-s-presidential-election-crosshairs-idUSKCN1VK128 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-deciders-ind...

true_religion 7y ago
The pew polling numbers posted higher in the thread are a fine source. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/15/facts-about-us-political-independents/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/15/facts-about... The gist of it is that for any given party, more people are not members of it (e.g. 70%+ of Americans are not Democrats) so you are not safe in guessing someone political affiliations. Stats wise, you will likely be wrong. Secondarily, saying that someone who leans to a party is basically in that party is wrong. For example, I am an independent. I lean republican on the local level, but in the Federal elections I lean Democrat. If you polled me, I would say I lean republican since that’s usually what’s on my mind

dragonwriter 7y ago

> Why the assumption of left or right, when at least in the US most people identify as independents? Most people don’t identify as independents, and, anyhow, studies of voting behavior show that most independents have a clear party leaning between the two major parties and are just as consistently attached to the party they lean toward as people who identify with the party. So not only is it the case that most people don't identify as independents, most of those who do aren't distinguishable from self-identified partisans when it comes to voting behavior.

arminiusreturns 7y ago
On the contrary, according to relatively recent Pew numbers from 2018 [1], around ~38% of American's identify as independents, with ~%31 democrat and ~%26 republican. To be fair many of them lean towards one party or another (your last point acknowledged), but independents are much more important in politics than they are usually given credit for. [1] https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/15/facts-about-us-political-independents/ https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/05/15/facts-about...
- dragonwriter 7y ago
  > On the contrary, according to relatively recent Pew numbers from 2018 [1], around ~38% of American's identify as independents, with ~%31 democrat and ~%26 republican. That's not “on the contrary”; 38% < 50%; most Americans don't identify as independents. Heck, even 43% (the number that don't identify as either Republicans or Democrats) is less than 50%; most Americans specifically identify as either Democrats or Republicans. > but independents are much more important in politics than they are usually given credit for. On the contrary, independents are given outsize importance by the major media, because they are treated as just as large of a group as they actually are, but are treated as if their voting behavior was much more different from that of self-identified partisans than it actually is.
  - arminiusreturns 7y ago
    You got me in a technically correct way, which is as they say, the best kind of correct. I think the keyword "majority" being defined as more than %50 being the crux, so I should have worded my statement better with a "most", "plurality" or "relative majority" instead. > most Americans specifically identify as either Democrats or Republicans Now you just did the same thing I did but in reverse! See my comments about more specific words for plurality such as "most". > independents are given outsize importance by the major media I don't think independents are given much importance at all by the major media, but I have increasingly disconnected from that circus too so I might not be a good judge of it.