4 ms·

Good information, but why not hire a dedicated project manager instead?

gregdoesit 7y ago
I'm the OP. Good question. I had this come up with many people and I wrote a longer response[1]. The short of it is, for small (2-5 person projects) this is a valuable skill to have. And a project manager would probably add _more_ work on top of it. If you think of a small team, let's say a tech startup with 5 people. How many of them are project managers versus developers? And would you rather a project manager with little context on your work "nag" you multiple times a day, or would you rather have control how you and the team do minimum effort project management? These are exactly the type of teams a typical project is run by. Also, most of the engineers are product-minded engineers[2]. In highly autonomous tech companies I see a small ratio of project managers - likely 1:50-1:30 with engineers. In companies where devs have little autonomy, this ratio goes up. I know a large, well-known consumer bank, where there are almost as many project managers, scrum masters, agile coaches and the managers of these people, as there are developers. Developers are not allowed to make any decisions - that's why all these other people are there! In all fairness, this company is spending loads of money with a consultancy to figure out how they can speed up software delivery, which is... slow. Who thought? [1] https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/a-team-where-everyone-is-a-leader#tensions-and-challenges https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/a-team-where-everyone-is-... [2] https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/the-product-minded-engineer/ https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/the-product-minded-engine...
singron 7y ago
I think management is too eager to hire a new role to fix a specific problem. E.g. if your product has bugs, you dont hire new people just to fix bugs. You should get your existing developers to fix bugs. Dedicated bug fixers won't have enough familiarity with the code or organizational clout to really be effective. QA teams run into this all the time. Similarly, not every project should have a dedicated project manager. They won't be familiar with the problems and they don't hold power in the organization. They might end up being little more than a clerical assistant to the tech lead or whoever actually has familiarity and power. Maybe I just haven't worked on the right projects.
- closeparen 7y ago
  Dedicated admin/clerical support for software projects sounds like a great idea, actually.
JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
When management won't fill the role, someone has to play the role of acting product manager. This will inevitably happen, and it will be the lead engineer's responsibility to interface with external stakeholders.

I'm the OP. Good question. I had this come up with many people and I wrote a longer response[1]. The short of it is, for small (2-5 person projects) this is a valuable skill to have. And a project manager would probably add _more_ work on top of it. If you think of a small team, let's say a tech startup with 5 people. How many of them are project managers versus developers? And would you rather a project manager with little context on your work "nag" you multiple times a day, or would you rather have control how you and the team do minimum effort project management? These are exactly the type of teams a typical project is run by. Also, most of the engineers are product-minded engineers[2]. In highly autonomous tech companies I see a small ratio of project managers - likely 1:50-1:30 with engineers. In companies where devs have little autonomy, this ratio goes up. I know a large, well-known consumer bank, where there are almost as many project managers, scrum masters, agile coaches and the managers of these people, as there are developers. Developers are not allowed to make any decisions - that's why all these other people are there! In all fairness, this company is spending loads of money with a consultancy to figure out how they can speed up software delivery, which is... slow. Who thought? [1] https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/a-team-where-everyone-is-a-leader#tensions-and-challenges https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/a-team-where-everyone-is-... [2] https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/the-product-minded-engineer/ https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/the-product-minded-engine...

singron 7y ago

I think management is too eager to hire a new role to fix a specific problem. E.g. if your product has bugs, you dont hire new people just to fix bugs. You should get your existing developers to fix bugs. Dedicated bug fixers won't have enough familiarity with the code or organizational clout to really be effective. QA teams run into this all the time. Similarly, not every project should have a dedicated project manager. They won't be familiar with the problems and they don't hold power in the organization. They might end up being little more than a clerical assistant to the tech lead or whoever actually has familiarity and power. Maybe I just haven't worked on the right projects.

closeparen 7y ago
Dedicated admin/clerical support for software projects sounds like a great idea, actually.

JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago

When management won't fill the role, someone has to play the role of acting product manager. This will inevitably happen, and it will be the lead engineer's responsibility to interface with external stakeholders.