10 ms·

An "annoying touchpad" is likely a dealbreaker for me. It's the holy grail for Linux to me and I feel like it's never been solved by anybody but Apple (w/o Linu

An "annoying touchpad" is likely a dealbreaker for me. It's the holy grail for Linux to me and I feel like it's never been solved by anybody but Apple (w/o Linux). That being said, I could exist in the command line most of the time...

jammygit 7y ago
A good keyboard with a keyboard driven distribution does the trick too though
AgloeDreams 7y ago
Google's modern Pixelbooks have it pretty close, coming from someone who uses a Magic Trackpad all day at work. Not perfect, but really close. As I understand, Apple's magic trick was basically feeding the trackpad inputs through the iPhone's touch logic.
- turtlebits 7y ago
  The Pixelbook touchpad is pretty bad. It's way too small, and it's not easy to right click without moving the pointer. Thank god it has a touchscreen.
l3db3tt3r 7y ago
I was kind of wondering what the "annoyances" were exactly. Left open-ended it is hard to say if it is a deal breaker or not.
ColanR 7y ago
I wonder if we should return to the trackball. I have an old KVM keyboard that has one built-in, and it's not so bad. Seems like it wouldn't get in the way like a touchpad does. Why is it that we stopped using those?
- war1025 7y ago
  Wouldn't fit in a super-thin form factor for one.
  - reaperducer 7y ago
    And since they're mechanical devices, they have to be cleaned and maintained more than most people want to. Reminds me of the days of cleaning mouse balls. Man, those things get covered with the grossest stuff.
    - war1025 7y ago
      I was just noticing the other day how disgusting my laser mouse is. Thought briefly about cleaning it, but then went back to my blissful ignorance.
jolmg 7y ago
I wish the author expanded on what "annoying" meant. Is it not responsive, too big, too small, jerky, etc?
- idle_zealot 7y ago
  I have one of these laptops. I would guess that he's talking about the same issue that I would describe as an "annoying touchpad" on my unit. The issue is a tad difficult to describe, but it feels like the trackpad is always a little delayed. I don't notice it when strating to move the cursor, but when ending a movement the cursor will consistently slowly slide a bit further in the direction it was being moved. This happens even for small movements, making fine adjustments a real pain. My trackpad also won't depress anywhere near its top-right corner, to the point where it only comfortably depresses at the bottom-left. I want to like this machine, but the issues are bad enough that I've committed to a keyboard-only setup software-wise.
  - ptx 7y ago
    There was a firmware update[1] to fix various issues with the trackpad – are the annoyances you describe there even after applying the update? [1] https://forum.pine64.org/announcements.php?aid=23 https://forum.pine64.org/announcements.php?aid=23
    - jhiesey 7y ago
      Yes this issue is still there unfortunately.
- mbreese 7y ago
  I have the ISO version of this (2nd batch) laptop, which has a different keyboard layout, but the same touchpad. The annoying touchpad doesn't work. It isn't accurate and difficult to click anything with any sort of accuracy. It also activates easily when you are typing. It's honestly the biggest issue with the laptop and the primary reason why I stopped using it after a few days. I might give it another go with a different keyboard layout and disabling the touchpad. The screen and case are great. The keyboard I have is meh, but not too different from a mid-grade Chromebook.
seba_dos1 7y ago
Apple's touchpads are nothing special, at least these days where you can easily get a high quality touchpad on pretty much anything but the cheapest laptops available. It's actually how macOS handles touchpads that makes them feel special. However, apparently Pinebook's one is actually pretty problematic and needs some firmware updates to work better.
- dplgk 7y ago
  Do you have an example? My mother in law just got a big fancy windows laptop and the track pad is small and same old clunkiness.
  - seba_dos1 7y ago
    I've been an exclusive user of touchpads on some Lenovo and Dell laptops over past 10 years and I also have Apple Magic Trackpad 2 and access to a Macbook, so I have a comparison. The only difference in the actual hardware that I noticed (aside of the surface texture, which is up to personal taste, and of course size, which you can easily check before even buying) is that the ones from the first half of the decade required some jitter-filtering in software, while newer ones did not. Also, Apple touchpad does an unusually big share of input filtering on the device itself, while most other ones leave it to the software (which is fine, unless your software does it poorly of course). Generally Windows drivers for touchpads used to be shit for a very long time; this only started to change a few years ago. On GNU/Linux it depends on the configuration, but there's a ridiculous amount of ways to screw it up, so some people don't even realize that it can be better (although it seems to be getting better with recent driver stacks).
- geerlingguy 7y ago
  I've tried the pads on the past few years' Dell XPS laptops, and the one on the MS Surface Book, and I can say they are definitely not as nice (physical touch-wise, ignoring the integration with the software at all) as Apple's. Whatever process Apple uses to finish the glass touchpad surface must be hard to replicate, because I haven't found anything comparable. Some are bearable, but not as much of a joy to use (compared to other input devices).
monocasa 7y ago
The track pad in my Matebook Pro is pretty damn close to my Macbook. Feels like the older mac track pads with the physical click instead of the faked haptic click.
rchaud 7y ago
Is it really that much of a dealbreaker at $200? I use a MBP as my main device which I'm told has the best trackpad. I still prefer to use an external wireless mouse.
Balanceinfinity 7y ago
Two words: trackball (or track-ball). Easiest on wrist and fingers for long days.
- slantyyz 7y ago
  Trackballs are very underrated, imo. While I'll admit Apple's trackpads have been the best laptop trackpads for the past several years, I personally hate trackpads. I always make sure I have a mouse in my laptop bag. This is going to date me, but my very first laptop was a Powerbook 170, and damn, I loved its trackball. For my desktop, I recently switched from a mouse to a Kensington trackball because I had some wrist issues using a mouse, and it's fantastic. I was concerned that my four monitor setup would be an issue moving the pointer from end to end, but it hasn't been an issue at all.

jammygit 7y ago

A good keyboard with a keyboard driven distribution does the trick too though

AgloeDreams 7y ago

Google's modern Pixelbooks have it pretty close, coming from someone who uses a Magic Trackpad all day at work. Not perfect, but really close. As I understand, Apple's magic trick was basically feeding the trackpad inputs through the iPhone's touch logic.

turtlebits 7y ago
The Pixelbook touchpad is pretty bad. It's way too small, and it's not easy to right click without moving the pointer. Thank god it has a touchscreen.

l3db3tt3r 7y ago

I was kind of wondering what the "annoyances" were exactly. Left open-ended it is hard to say if it is a deal breaker or not.

ColanR 7y ago

I wonder if we should return to the trackball. I have an old KVM keyboard that has one built-in, and it's not so bad. Seems like it wouldn't get in the way like a touchpad does. Why is it that we stopped using those?

war1025 7y ago
Wouldn't fit in a super-thin form factor for one.
- reaperducer 7y ago
  And since they're mechanical devices, they have to be cleaned and maintained more than most people want to. Reminds me of the days of cleaning mouse balls. Man, those things get covered with the grossest stuff.
  - war1025 7y ago
    I was just noticing the other day how disgusting my laser mouse is. Thought briefly about cleaning it, but then went back to my blissful ignorance.

jolmg 7y ago

I wish the author expanded on what "annoying" meant. Is it not responsive, too big, too small, jerky, etc?

idle_zealot 7y ago
I have one of these laptops. I would guess that he's talking about the same issue that I would describe as an "annoying touchpad" on my unit. The issue is a tad difficult to describe, but it feels like the trackpad is always a little delayed. I don't notice it when strating to move the cursor, but when ending a movement the cursor will consistently slowly slide a bit further in the direction it was being moved. This happens even for small movements, making fine adjustments a real pain. My trackpad also won't depress anywhere near its top-right corner, to the point where it only comfortably depresses at the bottom-left. I want to like this machine, but the issues are bad enough that I've committed to a keyboard-only setup software-wise.
- ptx 7y ago
  There was a firmware update[1] to fix various issues with the trackpad – are the annoyances you describe there even after applying the update? [1] https://forum.pine64.org/announcements.php?aid=23 https://forum.pine64.org/announcements.php?aid=23
  - jhiesey 7y ago
    Yes this issue is still there unfortunately.
mbreese 7y ago
I have the ISO version of this (2nd batch) laptop, which has a different keyboard layout, but the same touchpad. The annoying touchpad doesn't work. It isn't accurate and difficult to click anything with any sort of accuracy. It also activates easily when you are typing. It's honestly the biggest issue with the laptop and the primary reason why I stopped using it after a few days. I might give it another go with a different keyboard layout and disabling the touchpad. The screen and case are great. The keyboard I have is meh, but not too different from a mid-grade Chromebook.

seba_dos1 7y ago

Apple's touchpads are nothing special, at least these days where you can easily get a high quality touchpad on pretty much anything but the cheapest laptops available. It's actually how macOS handles touchpads that makes them feel special. However, apparently Pinebook's one is actually pretty problematic and needs some firmware updates to work better.

dplgk 7y ago
Do you have an example? My mother in law just got a big fancy windows laptop and the track pad is small and same old clunkiness.
- seba_dos1 7y ago
  I've been an exclusive user of touchpads on some Lenovo and Dell laptops over past 10 years and I also have Apple Magic Trackpad 2 and access to a Macbook, so I have a comparison. The only difference in the actual hardware that I noticed (aside of the surface texture, which is up to personal taste, and of course size, which you can easily check before even buying) is that the ones from the first half of the decade required some jitter-filtering in software, while newer ones did not. Also, Apple touchpad does an unusually big share of input filtering on the device itself, while most other ones leave it to the software (which is fine, unless your software does it poorly of course). Generally Windows drivers for touchpads used to be shit for a very long time; this only started to change a few years ago. On GNU/Linux it depends on the configuration, but there's a ridiculous amount of ways to screw it up, so some people don't even realize that it can be better (although it seems to be getting better with recent driver stacks).
geerlingguy 7y ago
I've tried the pads on the past few years' Dell XPS laptops, and the one on the MS Surface Book, and I can say they are definitely not as nice (physical touch-wise, ignoring the integration with the software at all) as Apple's. Whatever process Apple uses to finish the glass touchpad surface must be hard to replicate, because I haven't found anything comparable. Some are bearable, but not as much of a joy to use (compared to other input devices).

monocasa 7y ago

The track pad in my Matebook Pro is pretty damn close to my Macbook. Feels like the older mac track pads with the physical click instead of the faked haptic click.

rchaud 7y ago

Is it really that much of a dealbreaker at $200? I use a MBP as my main device which I'm told has the best trackpad. I still prefer to use an external wireless mouse.

Balanceinfinity 7y ago

Two words: trackball (or track-ball). Easiest on wrist and fingers for long days.

slantyyz 7y ago
Trackballs are very underrated, imo. While I'll admit Apple's trackpads have been the best laptop trackpads for the past several years, I personally hate trackpads. I always make sure I have a mouse in my laptop bag. This is going to date me, but my very first laptop was a Powerbook 170, and damn, I loved its trackball. For my desktop, I recently switched from a mouse to a Kensington trackball because I had some wrist issues using a mouse, and it's fantastic. I was concerned that my four monitor setup would be an issue moving the pointer from end to end, but it hasn't been an issue at all.