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> Because perception is so centered on thought, we tend to overappreciate the importance of thinking in our lives, in our behaviors and even values Very true.

> Because perception is so centered on thought, we tend to overappreciate the importance of thinking in our lives, in our behaviors and even values Very true. Thought can become our master easily. As a programmer, I often find myself struggling to get out of 'logic' mode or 'thinking' mode. > I'll let you ponder the discrepancy from an absolutely (perhaps) low-level logical machine to the possibility of a chaotic non-logical emergent high-level behavior. What it means for life, for AI, and possibly much bigger or smaller things we consider "inert", for now. Wonderfully put! I think the ideas of emergent behaviours are a saving grace for the incessant desire of ours to reduce everything to its atomic (in the sense of an atomic operation, not an atom) components. The emergent behaviours, can't be predicted. They can't be algorithmized. Becuase to build algorithms one must go down to those atomic operations. My wider concern is that we are currently obsessed with analytical thought and philosophy and that the continental philosophy has become a 2nd class citizen. I think this has happened becuase analytical thought lends itself to being algorithmized, whereas continental philosophy does not. Sorry, that was a bit of a tangent! Yes! Love the pictures! I have had the same thought/feeling when I first saw them too!

K0SM0S 7y ago
> I think the ideas of emergent behaviours are a saving grace for the incessant desire of ours to reduce everything to its atomic (in the sense of an atomic operation, not an atom) components. Very well said! Humans think a lot in terms of dichotomies (here the micro/macro, or whichever scale you want to consider), but I've heard biologists and physicists explaining that the closest to fundamental functions is closer to e (natural log), sinus (and hyperbolic stuff), the notion of "binary polarity" is very specific and quite limited — look at the Standard Model, it's clearly more complicated. I personally think that's how the dimension of time emerges in our perception (any perfect observer): periodicity in all phenomena (but with e.g. Fourier it gets extremely complex at emergent thresholds), the arrow of time (non-periodicity is basically high entropy, 'heat death'/homogeneity). Cue any such human-driven dichotomy (I think this one is relatively easy: the deepest processing system is probably close to "emotions", and these at the lowest level work in terms of "rather good" and "rather bad" (different sub-regions of the brain) + some "general integration" (third region). And what do you know, we tend to be heavily polarized in general, it's like most people feel reassured (familiarity) when things are explained in terms of black and white, left and right, ones and zeros. (Just my thoughts on it.) > My wider concern is that we are currently obsessed with analytical thought and philosophy and that the continental philosophy has become a 2nd class citizen. I think this has happened becuase analytical thought lends itself to being algorithmized, whereas continental philosophy does not. Strongly agreed. I think we're witnessing a kind of "revival" through many fields (some spiritual, some historical). Things are moving. I think dumb things like numbers also influence people, it's been ~20 years since the turn of the millenium and that's enough for 1 generation to weigh in and the others to accept change because "oh new era, obviously, new number!" — this plays at the subconscious level of very crude processing, me thinks. Nice tangent, hopefully not too hyperbolic. ;-)

K0SM0S 7y ago

> I think the ideas of emergent behaviours are a saving grace for the incessant desire of ours to reduce everything to its atomic (in the sense of an atomic operation, not an atom) components. Very well said! Humans think a lot in terms of dichotomies (here the micro/macro, or whichever scale you want to consider), but I've heard biologists and physicists explaining that the closest to fundamental functions is closer to e (natural log), sinus (and hyperbolic stuff), the notion of "binary polarity" is very specific and quite limited — look at the Standard Model, it's clearly more complicated. I personally think that's how the dimension of time emerges in our perception (any perfect observer): periodicity in all phenomena (but with e.g. Fourier it gets extremely complex at emergent thresholds), the arrow of time (non-periodicity is basically high entropy, 'heat death'/homogeneity). Cue any such human-driven dichotomy (I think this one is relatively easy: the deepest processing system is probably close to "emotions", and these at the lowest level work in terms of "rather good" and "rather bad" (different sub-regions of the brain) + some "general integration" (third region). And what do you know, we tend to be heavily polarized in general, it's like most people feel reassured (familiarity) when things are explained in terms of black and white, left and right, ones and zeros. (Just my thoughts on it.) > My wider concern is that we are currently obsessed with analytical thought and philosophy and that the continental philosophy has become a 2nd class citizen. I think this has happened becuase analytical thought lends itself to being algorithmized, whereas continental philosophy does not. Strongly agreed. I think we're witnessing a kind of "revival" through many fields (some spiritual, some historical). Things are moving. I think dumb things like numbers also influence people, it's been ~20 years since the turn of the millenium and that's enough for 1 generation to weigh in and the others to accept change because "oh new era, obviously, new number!" — this plays at the subconscious level of very crude processing, me thinks. Nice tangent, hopefully not too hyperbolic. ;-)