3 ms·

Have you actually tried to use Visual Studio? It's an unusable piece of crap. The navigation is nearly unusable. Don't focus the project navigation on a tree b

Have you actually tried to use Visual Studio? It's an unusable piece of crap. The navigation is nearly unusable. Don't focus the project navigation on a tree browser if you're not going to integrate it into the rest of the navigation workflow. NuGet regularly fails silently to restore packages. It uses a virtual filesystem that usually maps 1:1 to the actual project folder.. except files created outside of VS are completely invisible to it, unless manually added to the project. The project/solution files are very verbose and aren't designed to be edited by humans. The migration path from .NET Framework to .NET Core seems to be "create a new project, copy the files over manually, and copy over your old settings one by one". Some of these have been fixed for new projects, but there is no option to migrate to the new structure. Except, again, starting over with a new one.

NicoJuicy 7y ago
Euh, lol. You are talking about the biggest architecture change of. Net in 30 years ( going cross platform) and they are still going to support VB 6, WPF,.. Visual studio is actually a very robust IDE. The issue you are mentioning is .net framework project files and if you copy files within or to Visual Studio it will be added. .net framework only wants to add files you want to deploy ( not perfect, but okay). For migrating to. Net standard 2.0, remove assemblyinfo.cs and change the. Csproj file. You should manually add the Nugget packages again or change it to the new structure. The biggest issue is entity framework though, in a lot of projects. From. Net standard to . Net core is a lot easier. Seems pretty reasonable to me, updating other things ( eg. Android) have caused more issues than this. Ps. Navigating is mostly f12 of control+f12
eyegor 7y ago
As someone who uses visual studio + code literally every day, I'm not sure what you're referring to with most of these complaints. The project/solution files are bog standard xml, and well documented, but in general you shouldn't need to touch them. The migration from framework to core 3.0 is now very simple thanks to xaml support, but it used to be a huge hassle. You can literally just edit the tags in your csproj/fsproj/etc to enable different target frameworks, or you can use the ui [0], and then you'll need to do a nuget reinstall. One command [1]. As for running into bugs, they built bug/feature requests into the visual studio 2019 ide, or you can access it via the website [2]. They are usually very responsive, typically something within a couple of days. [0] https://stackoverflow.com/questions/57334018/visual-studio-2019-select-framework-version-for-net-core-class-library-projec https://stackoverflow.com/questions/57334018/visual-studio-2... [1] open package manager console, type 'update-package -reinstall'. [2] https://developercommunity.visualstudio.com https://developercommunity.visualstudio.com
- Nullabillity 7y ago
  > The project/solution files are bog standard xml, and well documented, but in general you shouldn't need to touch them. Project files are "bog standard" XML (except for all the weird magic, like variable resolution and conditionals), but solution files are some unholy VB-like abomination. But regardless, that doesn't help much when the schema is clearly not designed for human editing (incredibly verbose, UUIDs everywhere for references, etc). > The migration from framework to core 3.0 is now very simple thanks to xaml support, but it used to be a huge hassle. No idea how a GUI description language is supposed to help you here. > You can literally just edit the tags in your csproj/fsproj/etc to enable different target frameworks Didn't work for me. > or you can use the ui [0], and then you'll need to do a nuget reinstall. One command [1]. Keep in mind that that command is free to update dependencies as it feels like.
squiggleblaz 7y ago
I'm so completely not a Windows developer or a C++ developer, but seriously, the experience working with Visual Studio on Windows/C++ when I didn't really know what I was doing - but I had to do undocumented things (I needed to get Haskell to talk to some Windows apis, for which no bindings exist) - was incredible. Second to none. I'm half thinking about changing career direction it was so nice.
kunglao 7y ago
1. Navigation: subjective so gonna let that slide. 2. Downright bullshit. You are starting to whine. 3. Subjective but far from something that makes the IDE a "piece of crap" 4. You are starying to sound like you are in the wrong industry. 5. No. Change the .csproj and drop the AssemblyInfo.cs usually work for something that can actually be migrated. If you expect any project that targeted Windows to just migrate to cross platform using a NNF you are an idiot. At the very least you could have given an example of an IDE that you consider is better. You were just talking out of your arse.
- Nullabillity 7y ago
  > 1. Navigation: subjective so gonna let that slide. If you're going to pick a mode of navigation then at least commit to it. It's subjective whether or not any particular choice is good. The quality of the implementation, not so much. > 2. Downright bullshit. You are starting to whine. Sorry for wanting a package manager to... manage packages, I guess. Or maybe it's configured wrong? I guess it's too much to expect two Microsoft tools to work well together.. > 3. Subjective but far from something that makes the IDE a "piece of crap" Do you never edit your project files from outside the IDE? > 4. You are starying to sound like you are in the wrong industry. Compare a typical SBT build definition[0] or Cargo.toml[1] to a typical VS solution[2] or project[3]. Which would you feel the most confident about when modifying by hand? (Hint: For me, it's definitely not the one that is full of autogenerated cartesian products.) > 5. No. Change the .csproj and drop the AssemblyInfo.cs usually work for something that can actually be migrated. So why couldn't Microsoft include a tool for that migration? That seems like table stakes for such a migration project. We're not exactly talking about 2to3[4] or rustfix[5] here... > If you expect any project that targeted Windows to just migrate to cross platform using a NNF you are an idiot. Amazing how Microsoft are completely unable to even get close to what the Wine and Mono people did years ago. > At the very least you could have given an example of an IDE that you consider is better. You were just talking out of your arse. Throw a dart and you'll find something. If you want the out-of-the-box live-in-your-IDE experience then JetBrains' stuff is miles better than VS. Personally I moved on to Spacemacs[6] after a few years each of VS and IntelliJ. [0]: https://gitlab.com/teozkr/what-should-i-sing/blob/master/build.sbt https://gitlab.com/teozkr/what-should-i-sing/blob/master/bui... [1]: https://gitlab.com/teozkr/scankiosk/blob/master/scankiosk-ui/Cargo.toml https://gitlab.com/teozkr/scankiosk/blob/master/scankiosk-ui... [2]: https://github.com/getsentry/raven-csharp/blob/develop/src/SharpRaven.sln https://github.com/getsentry/raven-csharp/blob/develop/src/S... [3]: https://github.com/getsentry/raven-csharp/blob/develop/src/app/SharpRaven/SharpRaven.csproj https://github.com/getsentry/raven-csharp/blob/develop/src/a... [4]: https://docs.python.org/3.8/library/2to3.html https://docs.python.org/3.8/library/2to3.html [5]: https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfix https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfix [6]: https://www.spacemacs.org/ https://www.spacemacs.org/

NicoJuicy 7y ago

Euh, lol. You are talking about the biggest architecture change of. Net in 30 years ( going cross platform) and they are still going to support VB 6, WPF,.. Visual studio is actually a very robust IDE. The issue you are mentioning is .net framework project files and if you copy files within or to Visual Studio it will be added. .net framework only wants to add files you want to deploy ( not perfect, but okay). For migrating to. Net standard 2.0, remove assemblyinfo.cs and change the. Csproj file. You should manually add the Nugget packages again or change it to the new structure. The biggest issue is entity framework though, in a lot of projects. From. Net standard to . Net core is a lot easier. Seems pretty reasonable to me, updating other things ( eg. Android) have caused more issues than this. Ps. Navigating is mostly f12 of control+f12

eyegor 7y ago

As someone who uses visual studio + code literally every day, I'm not sure what you're referring to with most of these complaints. The project/solution files are bog standard xml, and well documented, but in general you shouldn't need to touch them. The migration from framework to core 3.0 is now very simple thanks to xaml support, but it used to be a huge hassle. You can literally just edit the tags in your csproj/fsproj/etc to enable different target frameworks, or you can use the ui [0], and then you'll need to do a nuget reinstall. One command [1]. As for running into bugs, they built bug/feature requests into the visual studio 2019 ide, or you can access it via the website [2]. They are usually very responsive, typically something within a couple of days. [0] https://stackoverflow.com/questions/57334018/visual-studio-2019-select-framework-version-for-net-core-class-library-projec https://stackoverflow.com/questions/57334018/visual-studio-2... [1] open package manager console, type 'update-package -reinstall'. [2] https://developercommunity.visualstudio.com https://developercommunity.visualstudio.com

Nullabillity 7y ago
> The project/solution files are bog standard xml, and well documented, but in general you shouldn't need to touch them. Project files are "bog standard" XML (except for all the weird magic, like variable resolution and conditionals), but solution files are some unholy VB-like abomination. But regardless, that doesn't help much when the schema is clearly not designed for human editing (incredibly verbose, UUIDs everywhere for references, etc). > The migration from framework to core 3.0 is now very simple thanks to xaml support, but it used to be a huge hassle. No idea how a GUI description language is supposed to help you here. > You can literally just edit the tags in your csproj/fsproj/etc to enable different target frameworks Didn't work for me. > or you can use the ui [0], and then you'll need to do a nuget reinstall. One command [1]. Keep in mind that that command is free to update dependencies as it feels like.

squiggleblaz 7y ago

I'm so completely not a Windows developer or a C++ developer, but seriously, the experience working with Visual Studio on Windows/C++ when I didn't really know what I was doing - but I had to do undocumented things (I needed to get Haskell to talk to some Windows apis, for which no bindings exist) - was incredible. Second to none. I'm half thinking about changing career direction it was so nice.

kunglao 7y ago

1. Navigation: subjective so gonna let that slide. 2. Downright bullshit. You are starting to whine. 3. Subjective but far from something that makes the IDE a "piece of crap" 4. You are starying to sound like you are in the wrong industry. 5. No. Change the .csproj and drop the AssemblyInfo.cs usually work for something that can actually be migrated. If you expect any project that targeted Windows to just migrate to cross platform using a NNF you are an idiot. At the very least you could have given an example of an IDE that you consider is better. You were just talking out of your arse.

Nullabillity 7y ago
> 1. Navigation: subjective so gonna let that slide. If you're going to pick a mode of navigation then at least commit to it. It's subjective whether or not any particular choice is good. The quality of the implementation, not so much. > 2. Downright bullshit. You are starting to whine. Sorry for wanting a package manager to... manage packages, I guess. Or maybe it's configured wrong? I guess it's too much to expect two Microsoft tools to work well together.. > 3. Subjective but far from something that makes the IDE a "piece of crap" Do you never edit your project files from outside the IDE? > 4. You are starying to sound like you are in the wrong industry. Compare a typical SBT build definition[0] or Cargo.toml[1] to a typical VS solution[2] or project[3]. Which would you feel the most confident about when modifying by hand? (Hint: For me, it's definitely not the one that is full of autogenerated cartesian products.) > 5. No. Change the .csproj and drop the AssemblyInfo.cs usually work for something that can actually be migrated. So why couldn't Microsoft include a tool for that migration? That seems like table stakes for such a migration project. We're not exactly talking about 2to3[4] or rustfix[5] here... > If you expect any project that targeted Windows to just migrate to cross platform using a NNF you are an idiot. Amazing how Microsoft are completely unable to even get close to what the Wine and Mono people did years ago. > At the very least you could have given an example of an IDE that you consider is better. You were just talking out of your arse. Throw a dart and you'll find something. If you want the out-of-the-box live-in-your-IDE experience then JetBrains' stuff is miles better than VS. Personally I moved on to Spacemacs[6] after a few years each of VS and IntelliJ. [0]: https://gitlab.com/teozkr/what-should-i-sing/blob/master/build.sbt https://gitlab.com/teozkr/what-should-i-sing/blob/master/bui... [1]: https://gitlab.com/teozkr/scankiosk/blob/master/scankiosk-ui/Cargo.toml https://gitlab.com/teozkr/scankiosk/blob/master/scankiosk-ui... [2]: https://github.com/getsentry/raven-csharp/blob/develop/src/SharpRaven.sln https://github.com/getsentry/raven-csharp/blob/develop/src/S... [3]: https://github.com/getsentry/raven-csharp/blob/develop/src/app/SharpRaven/SharpRaven.csproj https://github.com/getsentry/raven-csharp/blob/develop/src/a... [4]: https://docs.python.org/3.8/library/2to3.html https://docs.python.org/3.8/library/2to3.html [5]: https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfix https://github.com/rust-lang/rustfix [6]: https://www.spacemacs.org/ https://www.spacemacs.org/