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> In that scenario, the cost of charging your Tesla Model 3 is therefore zero. In the Toyota Camry LE hybrid it’s $0.05 per mile. How long would it take you to

> In that scenario, the cost of charging your Tesla Model 3 is therefore zero. In the Toyota Camry LE hybrid it’s $0.05 per mile. How long would it take you to make up for the Toyota’s $11,805 up-front price advantage? > For the average American who drives 1,000 miles per month, $0.05 per mile is $50 per month, or $600 per year. Divide $11,805 with $600 and you get almost 20 years. At least the article offers a generous alternative for comparison.

rconti 7y ago
The average american doesn't drive a toyota camry hybrid.
- neogodless 7y ago
  I'm not sure of your point. https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2019-us-vehicle-sales-figures-by-model/#vwspc-section-5 https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2019-us-vehicle-sales-figures-... The average American probably drives a fill-sized half-ton, pickup truck or small/medium SUV, or a relatively vanilla sedan from Toyota or Honda (including the Camry.)
JshWright 7y ago
Comparing the price of the cars and then talking about payback periods for "fueling" only makes sense if the _only_ difference between the cars is the source of power. That's obviously not the case, so the comparison is meaningless.
- neogodless 7y ago
  It's meaningless depending on what you're trying to predict. In this case, no doubt they want to "predict" that the market for expensive electric cars will be limited. Of course the current owners of a Tesla are homeowners with garages that care more about having a fancy car than about the total cost of ownership. But at least in the sedan market, the top 4 sellers (in the U.S.) are the Toyota Camry, Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla, and Honda Accord. More people want pickup trucks and SUVs, but for those that just prefer a sedan, they just want something that works and is affordable. Given all that, the total cost of ownership is a better tool for comparison, but obviously this article only looks at fuel costs and opportunity costs, without including other relevant variables.
linsomniac 7y ago
AFAICT, the 0.05/mile for the Camry doesn't include any costs other than the fuel. Teslas are insanely low maintenance, and while Toyotas tend to be low maintenance as well, there WILL be fluid changes and others (belts, plugs, etc) that the Tesla won't. Source: I have a Tesla and 2 Toyotas. :-)
- neogodless 7y ago
  Yes. I'm not saying the articles conclusion (that fuel costs are why electric vehicle market share is growing slowly) is accurate. Just that an argument only about the cost of electricity isn't really sufficient to dispel the premise. Total cost of ownership is a lot more than purchase price and fuel cost. You and I agree on that.
beatgammit 7y ago
Sort of, but if they're going to drag in purchase price differential, they need to add in other total cost of ownership figures, like repairs, as well as list the feature delta. Most of that cost difference is in the features included in the car other than the EV portion, so it's disingenuous to use the full value in comparing fuel costs. I doubt people are buying a Tesla because they think it's cheaper long term, but fuel cost is part of that decision.

rconti 7y ago

The average american doesn't drive a toyota camry hybrid.

neogodless 7y ago
I'm not sure of your point. https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2019-us-vehicle-sales-figures-by-model/#vwspc-section-5 https://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2019-us-vehicle-sales-figures-... The average American probably drives a fill-sized half-ton, pickup truck or small/medium SUV, or a relatively vanilla sedan from Toyota or Honda (including the Camry.)

JshWright 7y ago

Comparing the price of the cars and then talking about payback periods for "fueling" only makes sense if the _only_ difference between the cars is the source of power. That's obviously not the case, so the comparison is meaningless.

neogodless 7y ago
It's meaningless depending on what you're trying to predict. In this case, no doubt they want to "predict" that the market for expensive electric cars will be limited. Of course the current owners of a Tesla are homeowners with garages that care more about having a fancy car than about the total cost of ownership. But at least in the sedan market, the top 4 sellers (in the U.S.) are the Toyota Camry, Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla, and Honda Accord. More people want pickup trucks and SUVs, but for those that just prefer a sedan, they just want something that works and is affordable. Given all that, the total cost of ownership is a better tool for comparison, but obviously this article only looks at fuel costs and opportunity costs, without including other relevant variables.

linsomniac 7y ago

AFAICT, the 0.05/mile for the Camry doesn't include any costs other than the fuel. Teslas are insanely low maintenance, and while Toyotas tend to be low maintenance as well, there WILL be fluid changes and others (belts, plugs, etc) that the Tesla won't. Source: I have a Tesla and 2 Toyotas. :-)

neogodless 7y ago
Yes. I'm not saying the articles conclusion (that fuel costs are why electric vehicle market share is growing slowly) is accurate. Just that an argument only about the cost of electricity isn't really sufficient to dispel the premise. Total cost of ownership is a lot more than purchase price and fuel cost. You and I agree on that.

beatgammit 7y ago

Sort of, but if they're going to drag in purchase price differential, they need to add in other total cost of ownership figures, like repairs, as well as list the feature delta. Most of that cost difference is in the features included in the car other than the EV portion, so it's disingenuous to use the full value in comparing fuel costs. I doubt people are buying a Tesla because they think it's cheaper long term, but fuel cost is part of that decision.