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To the degree that some major motor companies are still investing in hydrogen for passenger vehicles, Tesla might actually be undervalued. Hydrogen makes no sen

To the degree that some major motor companies are still investing in hydrogen for passenger vehicles, Tesla might actually be undervalued. Hydrogen makes no sense for cars. Zero sense whatsoever when we have decent BEVs. Synthetic petrol makes more sense technically than hydrogen but has all the non-climate drawbacks of fossil fuels and is twice as expensive (with extremely low round-trip efficiency compared to a true electric car... like maybe a factor of 5 to 10 worse?) as regular fossil fuels. Taycan is not a better vehicle "by all reviews," but it is a decent vehicle, the only electric car by a non-startup manufacturer other than Tesla that is compelling. Its very low efficiency strongly limits its mass market uptake (low range, expensive charge, slow charge even with the 800V, expensive battery, etc) vs Tesla's vehicles, although might be okay for high margin vehicles.

clouddrover 7y ago
> Its very low efficiency strongly limits its mass market uptake The Taycan is an expensive sports car. It will never have mass market uptake regardless of its efficiency. The Macan is Porsche's best selling model because it's the cheapest Porsche you can buy and it's a compact SUV which is a popular body style. > expensive charge, slow charge even with the 800V The Taycan comes with three years of free charging on some charging networks. In any case, charging costs are the least of your worries relative to the cost of the car. The Taycan achieves 80% state of charge in 22.5 minutes. That's hardly slow.
- Robotbeat 7y ago
  Hey, Taycan isn't a terrible vehicle. I like the direction Porsche is going; almost all other conventional car makers completely don't understand EV (but Porsche does). But it ain't a whooping for the Model S, particularly when it is refreshed this year. And the low powertrain efficiency is part of the reason it's no Tesla killer.
  - clouddrover 7y ago
    The Taycan out accelerates, out manoeuvres, and out performs the Model S on track. You don't need to believe me on that, just see the results: https://www.thedrive.com/news/30467/watch-a-porsche-taycan-turbo-s-beat-a-tesla-model-s-p100d-in-a-drag-race https://www.thedrive.com/news/30467/watch-a-porsche-taycan-t... The Taycan has a two speed gearbox to help with both phases of acceleration: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uum9nffLasQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uum9nffLasQ The Taycan is a performance sports car and the Model S isn't. The Taycan is doing what it is built to do. What do you think the Taycan is built to do?
    - Robotbeat 7y ago
      They used an old version of the Model S, the P100D, not the current Performance version which is available today. Not a like-for-like test. (And if you want to compare not-yet-available versions with a similar price, you really should be comparing to the trimotor Model S.) And yeah, Model S is a more practical car than the Taycan yet still holds its own (in spite of Porsche's complex gearing system due to Tesla's electric powertrain advantage). I'm glad a worthy challenger to the Model S has finally been produced. Tesla is having to up their game to stay ahead, which is good. Competition between these two will push electric cars far ahead of fossil cars even at the highest levels of performance.
      - clouddrover 7y ago
        Ugh, please. The results are right in front of you. Don't cling to these articles of faith that they somehow didn't use the "true" or the "proper" Tesla.

clouddrover 7y ago

> Its very low efficiency strongly limits its mass market uptake The Taycan is an expensive sports car. It will never have mass market uptake regardless of its efficiency. The Macan is Porsche's best selling model because it's the cheapest Porsche you can buy and it's a compact SUV which is a popular body style. > expensive charge, slow charge even with the 800V The Taycan comes with three years of free charging on some charging networks. In any case, charging costs are the least of your worries relative to the cost of the car. The Taycan achieves 80% state of charge in 22.5 minutes. That's hardly slow.

Robotbeat 7y ago
Hey, Taycan isn't a terrible vehicle. I like the direction Porsche is going; almost all other conventional car makers completely don't understand EV (but Porsche does). But it ain't a whooping for the Model S, particularly when it is refreshed this year. And the low powertrain efficiency is part of the reason it's no Tesla killer.
- clouddrover 7y ago
  The Taycan out accelerates, out manoeuvres, and out performs the Model S on track. You don't need to believe me on that, just see the results: https://www.thedrive.com/news/30467/watch-a-porsche-taycan-turbo-s-beat-a-tesla-model-s-p100d-in-a-drag-race https://www.thedrive.com/news/30467/watch-a-porsche-taycan-t... The Taycan has a two speed gearbox to help with both phases of acceleration: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uum9nffLasQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uum9nffLasQ The Taycan is a performance sports car and the Model S isn't. The Taycan is doing what it is built to do. What do you think the Taycan is built to do?
  - Robotbeat 7y ago
    They used an old version of the Model S, the P100D, not the current Performance version which is available today. Not a like-for-like test. (And if you want to compare not-yet-available versions with a similar price, you really should be comparing to the trimotor Model S.) And yeah, Model S is a more practical car than the Taycan yet still holds its own (in spite of Porsche's complex gearing system due to Tesla's electric powertrain advantage). I'm glad a worthy challenger to the Model S has finally been produced. Tesla is having to up their game to stay ahead, which is good. Competition between these two will push electric cars far ahead of fossil cars even at the highest levels of performance.
    - clouddrover 7y ago
      Ugh, please. The results are right in front of you. Don't cling to these articles of faith that they somehow didn't use the "true" or the "proper" Tesla.