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That would just make working with files programmatically harder. The issue isn't that file names contain spaces but that we use programming languages that use s

That would just make working with files programmatically harder. The issue isn't that file names contain spaces but that we use programming languages that use spaces to separate fields/entries instead of proper data structures.

enriquto 7y ago
Do these languages allow spaces in their variable names? Filenames are the variable names of shell scripting.
- oalae5niMiel7qu 7y ago
  Wrong. Shell scripts have actual variables. They start with $. Filenames are one possible value you might store in these variables.
- DonHopkins 7y ago
  Funny how you just say these things as if they were true, without them being true, or any evidence. If you want to be pedantic, Unix has ALWAYS allowed ANY character in file names, except for "/" (unless you have a GatorBox). You once said: "Raw spaces in filenames are an abomination that make shell scripting unnecessarily difficult." No, bash is an abomination that makes shell scripting unnecessarily difficult. Prohibiting spaces in file names seems to be an obsession with you. (How about tabs? ;) You've said you don't see why people should be able to name their files anything they want, and that your reason for prohibiting billions of people from doing what they want is to make your bash scripts simpler. Then simply don't use bash, instead of trying to change the world. Read what I replied to you when you said that 7 months ago, and tell me if the world has changed so much since then that you're right this time around: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19952668 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19952668 Slash is the ONLY character you're not allowed to have under Unix. There are no good reasons to disallow spaces. Disallowing characters in file names that you're allowed to have solves absolutely no problems, it only causes them. There used to be a bug in the Gatorbox Mac Localtalk-to-Ethernet NFS bridge that could somehow trick Unix into putting slashes into file names via NFS, and Unix would totally shit itself when that happened. That was because Macs at the time (1991 or so) allowed you to use slashes (and spaces of course, but not colons), and of course those silly Mac people, being touchy feely humans instead of hard core nerds, would dare to name files with dates like "My Spreadsheet 01/02/1991". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GatorBox https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GatorBox I just tried to create a file name on the Mac in Finder with a slash in it, and it actually let me! But Emacs dired says it actually ended up with a ":" in it. So then I tried to create a file name with a colon in it, and Finder said: "Try using a name with fewer characters or with no punctuation marks." Must be backwards compatibility for all those old Mac files with slashes in their name. Go figure! If you think nobody would ever want to use a space or a slash in a file name, then you should get out more often and talk to real people in the real world. There are more of them than you seem to believe!
  - enriquto 7y ago
    LOL, you are my first internet stalker! I realize that I am preaching in the dark here. This has never deterred me to state my views.
    - DonHopkins 7y ago
      You give yourself far too much credit. Quoting your own words back to you isn't stalking. You're the one who claims to make a point of wrecking havoc with users on purpose. If you didn't want what you said coming back to you, you should have deleted that posting, or not written it in the first place. You were wrong and weren't able to support your views seven months ago, and you're still wrong and still can't explain yourself now. In the intervening months have you made any progress in changing even one person's mind not to use spaces in their file names? It would have been a much better use of your time to learn Python or JavaScript in those seven months, since it's bash that's actually causing you problems, not the people who use spaces in file names who you're so compelled to punish. Back to your argument -- go ahead and state your views: what is your evidence that "Filenames are the variable names of shell scripting"? Have you submitted pull requests to the Linux kernel and bash and any other affected libraries and applications to eliminate spaces from file names, and have they been accepted yet?
- anoncake 7y ago
  > Do these languages allow spaces in their variable names? AFAIK shell script doesn't. > Filenames are the variable names of shell scripting. Wrong

enriquto 7y ago

Do these languages allow spaces in their variable names? Filenames are the variable names of shell scripting.

oalae5niMiel7qu 7y ago
Wrong. Shell scripts have actual variables. They start with $. Filenames are one possible value you might store in these variables.
DonHopkins 7y ago
Funny how you just say these things as if they were true, without them being true, or any evidence. If you want to be pedantic, Unix has ALWAYS allowed ANY character in file names, except for "/" (unless you have a GatorBox). You once said: "Raw spaces in filenames are an abomination that make shell scripting unnecessarily difficult." No, bash is an abomination that makes shell scripting unnecessarily difficult. Prohibiting spaces in file names seems to be an obsession with you. (How about tabs? ;) You've said you don't see why people should be able to name their files anything they want, and that your reason for prohibiting billions of people from doing what they want is to make your bash scripts simpler. Then simply don't use bash, instead of trying to change the world. Read what I replied to you when you said that 7 months ago, and tell me if the world has changed so much since then that you're right this time around: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19952668 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19952668 Slash is the ONLY character you're not allowed to have under Unix. There are no good reasons to disallow spaces. Disallowing characters in file names that you're allowed to have solves absolutely no problems, it only causes them. There used to be a bug in the Gatorbox Mac Localtalk-to-Ethernet NFS bridge that could somehow trick Unix into putting slashes into file names via NFS, and Unix would totally shit itself when that happened. That was because Macs at the time (1991 or so) allowed you to use slashes (and spaces of course, but not colons), and of course those silly Mac people, being touchy feely humans instead of hard core nerds, would dare to name files with dates like "My Spreadsheet 01/02/1991". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GatorBox https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GatorBox I just tried to create a file name on the Mac in Finder with a slash in it, and it actually let me! But Emacs dired says it actually ended up with a ":" in it. So then I tried to create a file name with a colon in it, and Finder said: "Try using a name with fewer characters or with no punctuation marks." Must be backwards compatibility for all those old Mac files with slashes in their name. Go figure! If you think nobody would ever want to use a space or a slash in a file name, then you should get out more often and talk to real people in the real world. There are more of them than you seem to believe!
- enriquto 7y ago
  LOL, you are my first internet stalker! I realize that I am preaching in the dark here. This has never deterred me to state my views.
  - DonHopkins 7y ago
    You give yourself far too much credit. Quoting your own words back to you isn't stalking. You're the one who claims to make a point of wrecking havoc with users on purpose. If you didn't want what you said coming back to you, you should have deleted that posting, or not written it in the first place. You were wrong and weren't able to support your views seven months ago, and you're still wrong and still can't explain yourself now. In the intervening months have you made any progress in changing even one person's mind not to use spaces in their file names? It would have been a much better use of your time to learn Python or JavaScript in those seven months, since it's bash that's actually causing you problems, not the people who use spaces in file names who you're so compelled to punish. Back to your argument -- go ahead and state your views: what is your evidence that "Filenames are the variable names of shell scripting"? Have you submitted pull requests to the Linux kernel and bash and any other affected libraries and applications to eliminate spaces from file names, and have they been accepted yet?
anoncake 7y ago
> Do these languages allow spaces in their variable names? AFAIK shell script doesn't. > Filenames are the variable names of shell scripting. Wrong