3 ms·

Yeah, this is fucking insane, from top-to-bottom... left-to-right... inside-and-out... fucking insane. This is quite literally forced indentured servitude, or

Yeah, this is fucking insane, from top-to-bottom... left-to-right... inside-and-out... fucking insane. This is quite literally forced indentured servitude, or what I normally call "slavery." This is fucking slavery. At no point should one be forced to work before or after they've already paid their "debt" to society; extreme circumstances not withstanding (i.e. you still have a billion dollars after serving your time and can easily afford to pay back your debt). At no point, should ANYONE, be required to be imprisoned, worked, and have daily wages withheld for the "cost" of that imprisonment, furthering their imprisonment-- this is straight up a fucking violation of human rights and theft, the interest rate on the withholding is very likely not paid back, but I'm 100% sure they (prison owners or faction in that industry) profit on it. Where can I donate what little money I have to stopping this fucked up practice and making it illegal? Maybe I missed it in the article due to the increasing amounts of (naive) disbelief and (pure) rage I encountered as I read it.

cheez 7y ago
I'm sure you can contact the lawyers involved.
paulddraper 7y ago
> At no point should be forced to work before or aftere they've already paid their "debt" to society Weird wording. The fact that the debt has not been paid is why they're working, no? My dad's accountant embezzled from his business. The person spent all the money over the years and by the the time they were caught, there was little left. And unfortunately, that's a pretty typical story. (FYI, business insurance may or may not cover internal theft; that's often a separate policy or a rider.) In the end, the crime netted a hefty sum at the expense of the victim. If you take something, you should have to give it back. IDK what this vague "debt to society" is; I just know my dad is out $100k+.
- Zenbit_UX 7y ago
  That really sucks for your dad and this may be hard for you to answer objectively given your proximity to the situation but imagine if the guy who robbed your dad got tossed into this place with $100k + court fees and maybe child support if he had kids. At minimum wage pay, with ~20% of his earnings going to pay down the debt that's effectively a life sentence. My question to you is, does that seem fair for what is essentially a white collar, non-violent crime?
  - MikeAmelung 7y ago
    Where does it say they have to make minimum wage? If someone was stupid enough to hire the guy again as an accountant, he could make whatever he made before. Hell, like most of the geniuses in this story, he could embezzle from the next guy to pay the last one! Edit: I do think the system they have going on is absolutely ridiculous, especially considering the infrastructure costs when it's only being used for "more than 200 people" (which I'm assuming means less than 300). But some of the responses here from bleeding hearts are insane.
  - paulddraper 7y ago
    > does that seem fair It seems the very definition of equitable. (That said, I do think that the restitution amount can be adjusted, and courts do that. I object to the idea that 0% is appropriate.)
- stkdump 7y ago
  In genereal I find the wording "debt to society" very misleading. Does one have the right to commit a crime in exchange for punishment? I would say no. Punishment should serve as deterrant and as rehabilitation where possible, otherwise to keep society safe.

cheez 7y ago

I'm sure you can contact the lawyers involved.

paulddraper 7y ago

> At no point should be forced to work before or aftere they've already paid their "debt" to society Weird wording. The fact that the debt has not been paid is why they're working, no? My dad's accountant embezzled from his business. The person spent all the money over the years and by the the time they were caught, there was little left. And unfortunately, that's a pretty typical story. (FYI, business insurance may or may not cover internal theft; that's often a separate policy or a rider.) In the end, the crime netted a hefty sum at the expense of the victim. If you take something, you should have to give it back. IDK what this vague "debt to society" is; I just know my dad is out $100k+.

Zenbit_UX 7y ago
That really sucks for your dad and this may be hard for you to answer objectively given your proximity to the situation but imagine if the guy who robbed your dad got tossed into this place with $100k + court fees and maybe child support if he had kids. At minimum wage pay, with ~20% of his earnings going to pay down the debt that's effectively a life sentence. My question to you is, does that seem fair for what is essentially a white collar, non-violent crime?
- MikeAmelung 7y ago
  Where does it say they have to make minimum wage? If someone was stupid enough to hire the guy again as an accountant, he could make whatever he made before. Hell, like most of the geniuses in this story, he could embezzle from the next guy to pay the last one! Edit: I do think the system they have going on is absolutely ridiculous, especially considering the infrastructure costs when it's only being used for "more than 200 people" (which I'm assuming means less than 300). But some of the responses here from bleeding hearts are insane.
- paulddraper 7y ago
  > does that seem fair It seems the very definition of equitable. (That said, I do think that the restitution amount can be adjusted, and courts do that. I object to the idea that 0% is appropriate.)
stkdump 7y ago
In genereal I find the wording "debt to society" very misleading. Does one have the right to commit a crime in exchange for punishment? I would say no. Punishment should serve as deterrant and as rehabilitation where possible, otherwise to keep society safe.