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Are there any AAA studios using rust yet? I personally think it's not going to happen any time soon, but I'd be glad to be proven wrong. My theory that it won'

Are there any AAA studios using rust yet? I personally think it's not going to happen any time soon, but I'd be glad to be proven wrong. My theory that it won't happen without some form of inheritance-like structure. Games, like many forms of simulation, are inherently stateful and tends to fall hard on the OO-side of the Expression Problem spectrum. Traits tend to give you the best of both worlds, but in very important aspect it falls short: the traits themselves do not have data members. I saw a proposal where you could link object data members explicitly to data members that the trait required, which would probably fill that gap...but I don't think it has gone anywhere. Anybody know what I'm talking about so I can look up the progress?

steveklabnik 7y ago
Embark is a new AAA studio made up of ex-EA DICE folks who are heavily using Rust.
ShorsHammer 7y ago
Follow some of the rust gamedev discussion and it does surprise me that people are trying, albeit with small things. Triple-A is an entirely different beast, given that for some AAA games development started before rust even went v1.0 (2015). There's a big risk to be the first into this field, struggling to see why any large company with proven track records and developers who can produce what they need would decide to take the chance on a different lang without seeing smaller ones succeed with it first. I write rust professionally and people seem to strangely hype the language for many of it's non-usecases. A jackhammer should not be used to change your car tires. Personally doubt the benefits outweigh the extra energy expenditure required over traditional options but good luck to them I guess, especially in an ever-monetised MMO world rife with cheating.
elabajaba 7y ago
Ready at Dawn's (Lone Echo, The Order 1886) CTO said that going forwards everything new would be in Rust in 2018[1] (however, looking at their careers page all the dev jobs are asking for C++ and don't say anything about Rust). EA's SEED research division was also experimenting with Rust. As someone who's poked around in the current Rust gamedev ecosystem a bit, the publicly available libraries and frameworks aren't quite there yet for mid-large games (and are probably 1-2 years away at least for serious 3D development), though recent developments like the Legion ECS[2] (Amethyst, imo the most promising Rust 3D game engine seems like it will be switching from specs to Legion[3]), and Ultraviolet[4] (linear algebra library specifically for games & graphics which is faster than the alternatives for both runtime and compile times) are very promising. 1. https://twitter.com/AndreaPessino/status/1021532074153394176 https://twitter.com/AndreaPessino/status/1021532074153394176 2. https://crates.io/crates/legion https://crates.io/crates/legion 3. https://github.com/amethyst/rfcs/issues/22 https://github.com/amethyst/rfcs/issues/22 for a discussion about potentially moving from specs to Legion 4. https://crates.io/crates/ultraviolet https://crates.io/crates/ultraviolet
PudgePacket 7y ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/78bowa/hey_this_is_kyren_from_chucklefish_we_make_and/ https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/78bowa/hey_this_is_ky...
- steveklabnik 7y ago
  Chucklefish is no longer using Rust.
danbolt 7y ago
I think as ECS becomes more in vogue for AAA game development (I write almost entirely ECS C++17 on a big-budget project at work, for example) we’ll see Rust becoming more utilized. `specs` takes advantage of Rust’s compiler to provide very clean separation of concerns, opportunities for parallelism, and a clear path for unit testing. It just takes longer for entrenched technologies to change in the big-budget space.
- BlueTemplar 7y ago
  What do you mean "more" in vogue ? Hasn't ECS been used in big game development for more than two decades now ?
  - danbolt 7y ago
    Hmm, I guess when I say “ECS”, I mean a setup where entities are solely IDs, components are data without functionality, and systems are stateless operations on entities that have certain components “attached”. I’d contrast this with a more traditional “OO” game or Unity’s actor/prefab way of doing things.
    - BlueTemplar 7y ago
      Oh, you mean game programmers rediscovering good OOP practices ? https://www.gamedev.net/blogs/entry/2265481-oop-is-dead-long-live-oop/ https://www.gamedev.net/blogs/entry/2265481-oop-is-dead-long...
      - danbolt 7y ago
        Sure? I guess so.

steveklabnik 7y ago

Embark is a new AAA studio made up of ex-EA DICE folks who are heavily using Rust.

ShorsHammer 7y ago

Follow some of the rust gamedev discussion and it does surprise me that people are trying, albeit with small things. Triple-A is an entirely different beast, given that for some AAA games development started before rust even went v1.0 (2015). There's a big risk to be the first into this field, struggling to see why any large company with proven track records and developers who can produce what they need would decide to take the chance on a different lang without seeing smaller ones succeed with it first. I write rust professionally and people seem to strangely hype the language for many of it's non-usecases. A jackhammer should not be used to change your car tires. Personally doubt the benefits outweigh the extra energy expenditure required over traditional options but good luck to them I guess, especially in an ever-monetised MMO world rife with cheating.

elabajaba 7y ago

Ready at Dawn's (Lone Echo, The Order 1886) CTO said that going forwards everything new would be in Rust in 2018[1] (however, looking at their careers page all the dev jobs are asking for C++ and don't say anything about Rust). EA's SEED research division was also experimenting with Rust. As someone who's poked around in the current Rust gamedev ecosystem a bit, the publicly available libraries and frameworks aren't quite there yet for mid-large games (and are probably 1-2 years away at least for serious 3D development), though recent developments like the Legion ECS[2] (Amethyst, imo the most promising Rust 3D game engine seems like it will be switching from specs to Legion[3]), and Ultraviolet[4] (linear algebra library specifically for games & graphics which is faster than the alternatives for both runtime and compile times) are very promising. 1. https://twitter.com/AndreaPessino/status/1021532074153394176 https://twitter.com/AndreaPessino/status/1021532074153394176 2. https://crates.io/crates/legion https://crates.io/crates/legion 3. https://github.com/amethyst/rfcs/issues/22 https://github.com/amethyst/rfcs/issues/22 for a discussion about potentially moving from specs to Legion 4. https://crates.io/crates/ultraviolet https://crates.io/crates/ultraviolet

PudgePacket 7y ago

https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/78bowa/hey_this_is_kyren_from_chucklefish_we_make_and/ https://www.reddit.com/r/rust/comments/78bowa/hey_this_is_ky...

steveklabnik 7y ago
Chucklefish is no longer using Rust.

danbolt 7y ago

I think as ECS becomes more in vogue for AAA game development (I write almost entirely ECS C++17 on a big-budget project at work, for example) we’ll see Rust becoming more utilized. `specs` takes advantage of Rust’s compiler to provide very clean separation of concerns, opportunities for parallelism, and a clear path for unit testing. It just takes longer for entrenched technologies to change in the big-budget space.

BlueTemplar 7y ago
What do you mean "more" in vogue ? Hasn't ECS been used in big game development for more than two decades now ?
- danbolt 7y ago
  Hmm, I guess when I say “ECS”, I mean a setup where entities are solely IDs, components are data without functionality, and systems are stateless operations on entities that have certain components “attached”. I’d contrast this with a more traditional “OO” game or Unity’s actor/prefab way of doing things.
  - BlueTemplar 7y ago
    Oh, you mean game programmers rediscovering good OOP practices ? https://www.gamedev.net/blogs/entry/2265481-oop-is-dead-long-live-oop/ https://www.gamedev.net/blogs/entry/2265481-oop-is-dead-long...
    - danbolt 7y ago
      Sure? I guess so.