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Google Stadia Should've Used Windows Instead of Linux

4 points by me551ah 7y ago

billconan 7y ago
As someone who had worked on cloud gaming for a few years, I think using Linux is the right thing to do. We used windows, and it was a disaster. Windows is not a multi-user system. User isolation is so difficult. Without user isolation, user A can access user B's data or login information, and it's difficult to clean up a seat's state without a slow reboot. We did lots of ugly hacks to make it work, as the OS is not open-sourced. Also, existing windows games don't support multi-users, the same CD key can only be used by one user. All these issues made virtual machine sharing difficult and hence resulted in very high cost. The one thing done right by google is moving to linux and developing games specifically for cloud.
- me551ah 7y ago
  But microsoft has now launched support for DirectX in docker containers. So it is possible to containerize games on Windows now. That should take away a lot of the pain points around user isolation.
  - StudentStuff 7y ago
    Running games on Linux is trivial at this point, Valve has made WINE so easy to use that all my games from Windows work without me lifting a finger. Civ 5? No problem. Random Indie Game that only ever worked on Windows 7? Works great. Google did not put sufficient resources towards building a broad platform. If they had, then the Stadia catalog would have many more titles. Instead the AAA rabbit hole has consumed the resources spent on Stadia, and players still get a crummy experience.
    - me551ah 7y ago
      Yes, but in my experience AAA titles don't always work that great with WINE. I tried overwatch a few years ago and it was a buggy mess. It's great for older titles though.
    - alpaca128 7y ago
      > Running games on Linux is trivial at this point Running most things on Linux is trivial if you're lucky enough to run the right hardware and software configuration. I'm not one of the lucky ones and even on my otherwise pretty compatible desktop more than 50% of my Steam games don't even start with Wine/Proton. Not to mention games from other distributors where you have to get both the launcher and the game to run at the same time. Lutris helps but may still need a lot of fiddling if it doesn't run on first try. On average it's simply not comparable to Windows where a game not running well is a rare exception.
bdavis__ 7y ago
you could have said the same thing about the google office suite. just run the existing windows programs. doing it in linux lets google go vertical. they can own and manipulate the entire stack. and not pay for windows licenses. now the games are the hurdle. get a critical mass, and then the studios would build for Stadia as a prime target.
- me551ah 7y ago
  Google's office suite is a collection of tools made by Google which run in the browser. It doesn't need to run any third party software which wasn't designed as a plugin. Stadia on the other hand needs to run third party software which wasn't originally built to run on it
  - bdavis__ 7y ago
    i agree. but if Stadia had enough market penetration the game studios would target it instead of windows.
    - me551ah 7y ago
      It's like a chicken and egg problem. Stadia isn't getting many users cause it doesn't have many games and studios aren't porting games cause of too few users

4 points by me551ah 7y ago

As someone who had worked on cloud gaming for a few years, I think using Linux is the right thing to do. We used windows, and it was a disaster. Windows is not a multi-user system. User isolation is so difficult. Without user isolation, user A can access user B's data or login information, and it's difficult to clean up a seat's state without a slow reboot. We did lots of ugly hacks to make it work, as the OS is not open-sourced. Also, existing windows games don't support multi-users, the same CD key can only be used by one user. All these issues made virtual machine sharing difficult and hence resulted in very high cost. The one thing done right by google is moving to linux and developing games specifically for cloud.

me551ah 7y ago
But microsoft has now launched support for DirectX in docker containers. So it is possible to containerize games on Windows now. That should take away a lot of the pain points around user isolation.
- StudentStuff 7y ago
  Running games on Linux is trivial at this point, Valve has made WINE so easy to use that all my games from Windows work without me lifting a finger. Civ 5? No problem. Random Indie Game that only ever worked on Windows 7? Works great. Google did not put sufficient resources towards building a broad platform. If they had, then the Stadia catalog would have many more titles. Instead the AAA rabbit hole has consumed the resources spent on Stadia, and players still get a crummy experience.
  - me551ah 7y ago
    Yes, but in my experience AAA titles don't always work that great with WINE. I tried overwatch a few years ago and it was a buggy mess. It's great for older titles though.
  - alpaca128 7y ago
    > Running games on Linux is trivial at this point Running most things on Linux is trivial if you're lucky enough to run the right hardware and software configuration. I'm not one of the lucky ones and even on my otherwise pretty compatible desktop more than 50% of my Steam games don't even start with Wine/Proton. Not to mention games from other distributors where you have to get both the launcher and the game to run at the same time. Lutris helps but may still need a lot of fiddling if it doesn't run on first try. On average it's simply not comparable to Windows where a game not running well is a rare exception.

bdavis__ 7y ago

you could have said the same thing about the google office suite. just run the existing windows programs. doing it in linux lets google go vertical. they can own and manipulate the entire stack. and not pay for windows licenses. now the games are the hurdle. get a critical mass, and then the studios would build for Stadia as a prime target.

me551ah 7y ago
Google's office suite is a collection of tools made by Google which run in the browser. It doesn't need to run any third party software which wasn't designed as a plugin. Stadia on the other hand needs to run third party software which wasn't originally built to run on it
- bdavis__ 7y ago
  i agree. but if Stadia had enough market penetration the game studios would target it instead of windows.
  - me551ah 7y ago
    It's like a chicken and egg problem. Stadia isn't getting many users cause it doesn't have many games and studios aren't porting games cause of too few users