4 ms·

If you had a serious disease that was going to kill you quickly you wouldn't have time to look into alternative treatments. You would take the path of highest s

If you had a serious disease that was going to kill you quickly you wouldn't have time to look into alternative treatments. You would take the path of highest success rate, which in case you havent looked at the data, is chemo for many aggressive cancers.

Ididntdothis 7y ago
It’s not always like that. A lot of this stuff goes on for years and several rounds of treatment.
- mmaunder 7y ago
  Thanks for the insight. Let me tell you about my friend who just got done being treated for advanced leukemia at City of Hope in LA. He would have died quickly and painfully if they didnt hit it hard with chemo. He's in much better shape now and is waiting for a bone marrow transplant. The treatment bought him valuable time and took the pain away. Yeah he will likely be treated until he eventually dies. Are you suggesting he should have instead gone on a juice fast?
  - Ididntdothis 7y ago
    No. I and saying that these treatments often have horrific side effects so it’s no surprise people start liking at other things. I personally would probably do a juice fast or similar and chemo.
    - mmaunder 7y ago
      A juice fast on chemo would kill you. It would throw your electrolytes out of whack and starve your body of protein. The lack of calories would leave you too weak to complete treatment. And cancer loves sugar. So you'd be feeding your tumors while starving your body of what it needs.
    - andai 7y ago
      As the sibling commenter said, cancer loves sugar indeed! Better do a "regular" fast instead -- regular meaning just water, but also meaning often. Autophagy (the [sub-]cellular janitor) kicks in after 24h* fasting and recycles and repairs old and damaged cells. And better to do it to maintain / optimize health now. Why wait? * I've heard plenty of benefits fasting 24-48h, but going longer than that I don't think justifies the risk. -- To a lesser degree you can get the same benefits with fasting's little brother, Time Restricted Eating (these days called Intermittent Fasting) where you eat only during an 8 hour window. Less autophagy but you will get some lowered inflammation which is great too (inflammation found to cause many mental as well as physical illnesses).
      - mmaunder 7y ago
        I'm going go assume you're not providing medical advice to cancer patients to fast during chemo. That would be... insane. If you have cancer, talk to your oncology team including doc, nurses and nutritionist that they will provide. However... as a stage 4 survivor who fucked up my cancer with 18 weeks of chemo, lots of healthy eating, exercise and an amazing support system.... I currently practice intermittent fasting in a 16/8 cycle. I only drink black coffee and water during a fast 8pm to noon. I've found it has improved my energy levels (which were already awesome) and mental acuity. And consequently my productivity and appetite to take on more work. So yeah, post chemo I'm a fan. But I only tried this years later and after my body had healed up. And yoga. Which is amazing. Every day.
        andai 7y ago
        Congratulations on your recovery! Yeah, I was suggesting to GP that (1) better to prevent cancer than to treat it, and (2) better use fasting than fructose! With that said, Conclusion: STF during chemotherapy is well tolerated and appears to improve QOL and fatigue during chemotherapy. Larger studies should prove the effect of STF as an adjunct to chemotherapy. There were no serious adverse effects. Fasting started 36 h before and ended 24 h after chemotherapy (60 h-fasting period). Source: The effects of short-term fasting on quality of life and tolerance to chemotherapy in patients with breast and ovarian cancer: a randomized cross-over pilot study. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5921787/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5921787/ --- See also: Effects of short-term fasting on cancer treatment https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6530042/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6530042/ Fasting and cancer: benefits and effects (Improving quality of life during chemotherapy) https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/324169.php#improving-quality-of-life-during-chemotherapy https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/324169.php#improvi...
sandworm101 7y ago
Or the path of any success rate. Yoga won't help you one bit if your apendix is about to burst. Acupuncture has never set a broken bone or de-clothed a crainial artery to relieve a stroke. Scientific medicine is a mirical we should all appreciate every day. Without it, half the people reading this probably wouldn't be here.
- papermachete 7y ago
  Dude medicine has a failure rate as well, it's nothing that interesting. It's clouded in economics and politics, meaning it will never be truly altruistic. It's not much different from thinking software is a miracle. Human error is a leading cause of death in the West.
  - mmaunder 7y ago
    Ever even spoken to an oncology nurse or doctor? They are drenched in altruism. You have no idea what you're talking about. Dude.
  - threatofrain 7y ago
    Neither selfishness nor selflessness need be that pure.
- andai 7y ago
  Can confirm, was born dead and had to be zapped back to life.
  - mmaunder 7y ago
    Welcome back buddy! Need more people in this thread who arent cigar smoking on their balcony telling doctors to get off their lawn. People who have actually stared into the abyss and been pulled back by the awesomeness that is modern medicine.
- Ididntdothis 7y ago
  Totally agree. Modern medicine is a miracle. But it’s also not the solution to everything. When I taught yoga classes I saw quite a few people who had had multiple failed surgeries for back, knee and other problems. They got their problems under control by doing some simple exercises and more awareness of their movement patterns. This can’t be denied either.
masonic 7y ago
But not everybody does, including otherwise intelligent people like Steve Jobs and Steve McQueen.

Ididntdothis 7y ago

It’s not always like that. A lot of this stuff goes on for years and several rounds of treatment.

mmaunder 7y ago
Thanks for the insight. Let me tell you about my friend who just got done being treated for advanced leukemia at City of Hope in LA. He would have died quickly and painfully if they didnt hit it hard with chemo. He's in much better shape now and is waiting for a bone marrow transplant. The treatment bought him valuable time and took the pain away. Yeah he will likely be treated until he eventually dies. Are you suggesting he should have instead gone on a juice fast?
- Ididntdothis 7y ago
  No. I and saying that these treatments often have horrific side effects so it’s no surprise people start liking at other things. I personally would probably do a juice fast or similar and chemo.
  - mmaunder 7y ago
    A juice fast on chemo would kill you. It would throw your electrolytes out of whack and starve your body of protein. The lack of calories would leave you too weak to complete treatment. And cancer loves sugar. So you'd be feeding your tumors while starving your body of what it needs.
  - andai 7y ago
    As the sibling commenter said, cancer loves sugar indeed! Better do a "regular" fast instead -- regular meaning just water, but also meaning often. Autophagy (the [sub-]cellular janitor) kicks in after 24h* fasting and recycles and repairs old and damaged cells. And better to do it to maintain / optimize health now. Why wait? * I've heard plenty of benefits fasting 24-48h, but going longer than that I don't think justifies the risk. -- To a lesser degree you can get the same benefits with fasting's little brother, Time Restricted Eating (these days called Intermittent Fasting) where you eat only during an 8 hour window. Less autophagy but you will get some lowered inflammation which is great too (inflammation found to cause many mental as well as physical illnesses).
    - mmaunder 7y ago
      I'm going go assume you're not providing medical advice to cancer patients to fast during chemo. That would be... insane. If you have cancer, talk to your oncology team including doc, nurses and nutritionist that they will provide. However... as a stage 4 survivor who fucked up my cancer with 18 weeks of chemo, lots of healthy eating, exercise and an amazing support system.... I currently practice intermittent fasting in a 16/8 cycle. I only drink black coffee and water during a fast 8pm to noon. I've found it has improved my energy levels (which were already awesome) and mental acuity. And consequently my productivity and appetite to take on more work. So yeah, post chemo I'm a fan. But I only tried this years later and after my body had healed up. And yoga. Which is amazing. Every day.
      - andai 7y ago
        Congratulations on your recovery! Yeah, I was suggesting to GP that (1) better to prevent cancer than to treat it, and (2) better use fasting than fructose! With that said, Conclusion: STF during chemotherapy is well tolerated and appears to improve QOL and fatigue during chemotherapy. Larger studies should prove the effect of STF as an adjunct to chemotherapy. There were no serious adverse effects. Fasting started 36 h before and ended 24 h after chemotherapy (60 h-fasting period). Source: The effects of short-term fasting on quality of life and tolerance to chemotherapy in patients with breast and ovarian cancer: a randomized cross-over pilot study. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5921787/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5921787/ --- See also: Effects of short-term fasting on cancer treatment https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6530042/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6530042/ Fasting and cancer: benefits and effects (Improving quality of life during chemotherapy) https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/324169.php#improving-quality-of-life-during-chemotherapy https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/324169.php#improvi...

sandworm101 7y ago

Or the path of any success rate. Yoga won't help you one bit if your apendix is about to burst. Acupuncture has never set a broken bone or de-clothed a crainial artery to relieve a stroke. Scientific medicine is a mirical we should all appreciate every day. Without it, half the people reading this probably wouldn't be here.

papermachete 7y ago
Dude medicine has a failure rate as well, it's nothing that interesting. It's clouded in economics and politics, meaning it will never be truly altruistic. It's not much different from thinking software is a miracle. Human error is a leading cause of death in the West.
- mmaunder 7y ago
  Ever even spoken to an oncology nurse or doctor? They are drenched in altruism. You have no idea what you're talking about. Dude.
- threatofrain 7y ago
  Neither selfishness nor selflessness need be that pure.
andai 7y ago
Can confirm, was born dead and had to be zapped back to life.
- mmaunder 7y ago
  Welcome back buddy! Need more people in this thread who arent cigar smoking on their balcony telling doctors to get off their lawn. People who have actually stared into the abyss and been pulled back by the awesomeness that is modern medicine.
Ididntdothis 7y ago
Totally agree. Modern medicine is a miracle. But it’s also not the solution to everything. When I taught yoga classes I saw quite a few people who had had multiple failed surgeries for back, knee and other problems. They got their problems under control by doing some simple exercises and more awareness of their movement patterns. This can’t be denied either.

masonic 7y ago

But not everybody does, including otherwise intelligent people like Steve Jobs and Steve McQueen.