5 ms·

Node v0.4 announcement

128 points by Uncle_Sam 16y ago

jerome_etienne 16y ago
I updated the ubuntu ppa deb to 0.4.0 To install node.js 0.4.0 on ubuntu do sudo add-apt-repository ppa:jerome-etienne/neoip && sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get install nodejs
- larrykubin 16y ago
  This installed node 0.2.6 on my machine.
  - dekz 16y ago
    theres a node manager in the npm repository called n. npm intsall n n install 0.4.0 want to use an older version installed? n use 0.2.6
    - aaronblohowiak 16y ago
      Nave plays well with npm, so you can have different sets of libraries for the different versions of node that you have installed (similar to rvm if you're a rubyist.) This is mostly important when you have libraries that are compiled C/C++.
nailer 16y ago
> A specially named directory, node_modules/, is searched in the current directory for any modules. Awesome. Currently NPM expects unprivileged users to have access to /usr/local, and a lot of node tutorials encourage global repermissioning of this directory, which is Bad Unix. Hopefully, once NPM gets updated, you'll have a Python virtualenv/Ruby equivalent style project-specific install system. Update: https://github.com/isaacs/nave https://github.com/isaacs/nave says Nave provides virtualenvs for Node, which may be worth checking out.
- jdub 16y ago
  npm currently supports ~/.node_modules, by the way (which node has supported for ages)
  - coenhyde 16y ago
    But then you are still relying on modules available and their versions on the system where the node app is running. Bundling is a much more reliable way of doing things.
    - jdub 16y ago
      Bundling (and the like) is a necessary evil of ecosystems riding hard on the bleeding edge, like node.js... ... and I would say Ruby/Rails, but they ought to be growing up by now, and integrating sensibly with platform package management. :-) The difference between Python and Ruby on Debian/Ubuntu systems is astounding, and as the node.js ecosystem matures I dearly hope it will look more like the Python world than the unending adolescence of Ruby/Rails.
      - mnutt 16y ago
        I don't think it's really fair to lay all of the blame with node and ruby/rails in this case; the distro package managers are just as much at fault: http://sheddingbikes.com/posts/1285063820.html http://sheddingbikes.com/posts/1285063820.html It really just depends on what you're trying to do. As a desktop user you probably care most about stability; we can't have a python upgrade breaking apt. As a developer it's often important to have an up-to-date version of the tools and libraries you're using.
      - steveklabnik 16y ago
        > the unending adolescence It has nothing to do with adolescence, and everything to do with different priorities. Debian favors stability, Ruby favors breakneck progress. Each has their pros and cons.
  - nailer 16y ago
deleted 16y ago
[deleted]
philsalesses 16y ago
I'm starting a new project and I can't wait to see what this thing can do.
arnorhs 16y ago
Which version of v8 was being used in 2.x/3.x ? The v8 change log is very detailed. Anybody got a helicopter view of speed improvements and/or other changes?
- bnoordhuis 16y ago
  > Which version of v8 was being used in 2.x/3.x ? Several. Since node.js 0.2.0, V8 has been incrementally upgraded from 2.4.2 to 3.1.2. The changelog is here: https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/deps/v8/ChangeLog https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/deps/v8/ChangeLog
ladon86 16y ago
Any word on express.js and connect compatibility?
- tjarratt 16y ago
  Looking at the recent commits in the last two days, it doesn't look like visionmedia has changed anything for 0.4.0 in particular. If you're interested, you should try it out and file issues appropriately. I'll probably be doing exactly that tonight.
- mcantelon 16y ago
  Looks like it's a go: http://twitter.com/tjholowaychuk/status/35869375533682688 http://twitter.com/tjholowaychuk/status/35869375533682688
invisible 16y ago
There is still some confusion for me as to whether it's "production ready." Ryan Dahl said for a long time that it wasn't ready for production, but I haven't heard anything like that recently. In fact, I've heard others proclaim they're using it for larger sites just fine (citing poor SSL support as one of the primary drawbacks). I also remember Ryan saying that the memory management within V8 caused a lot of the bugs they were dealing with. So what's the real status of the project in terms of putting it into production?
- chapel 16y ago
  I don't speek for Ryan Dahl or the community at large, but from what I can tell hanging out in the IRC room and reading the mail list is that it is ready for production for just about anyone. Now mind you, anything this young isn't going to be perfect, but what systems are? As far as I know the SSL issues are fixed or being patched ASAP, so you should be able to get something up and running and feel fairly secure in it 0.4.0 brings quite a few API changes from 0.2.6, so if you haven't been keeping up, you should really scour the API docs. You can also check out the wiki for a guide on migrating. https://github.com/ry/node/wiki/Migrating-from-v0.2-to-v0.3 https://github.com/ry/node/wiki/Migrating-from-v0.2-to-v0.3
- gmac 16y ago
  I was all set to start a new project on node.js a couple of months ago, but ended up back on Rails. Not because node.js itself seemed flaky, but because libraries were scarce (e.g. anyone know of a credible ORM?) and, where available, often in alpha. This isn't a criticism: it's inevitable in a young platform, and I'd happily help develop the libraries. But it didn't seem a feasible option for a project that (a) had deadlines and (b) needed features beyond the (impressive) node.js core.
  - davej 16y ago
    > anyone know of a credible ORM? Node devs tend to take a different approach to Rails/Django in this regard, there's no single ORM with lots of database backends (ala ActiveRecord). This is probably related to the fact that Node devs tend to use tools like Redis, Mongo and Couch rather than traditional relational databases like MySQL and Postgres which all have similar SQL interfaces. There are some really nice libraries and modeling tools available but they're not database agnostic SQL ORMs, for example recently I've been using Mongoose: http://mongoosejs.com/ http://mongoosejs.com/ I've come from the Django world so I empathise with the "How do I do [insert Django/Rails feature here]?" mindset, but a lot of the time the Django/Rails just doesn't work well Node. Node.js is a single-threaded, event-based, non-blocking server; it really is a totally different paradigm so you have to be prepared to rethink the modus operandi for developing web applications.

128 points by Uncle_Sam 16y ago

I updated the ubuntu ppa deb to 0.4.0 To install node.js 0.4.0 on ubuntu do sudo add-apt-repository ppa:jerome-etienne/neoip && sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get install nodejs

larrykubin 16y ago
This installed node 0.2.6 on my machine.
- dekz 16y ago
  theres a node manager in the npm repository called n. npm intsall n n install 0.4.0 want to use an older version installed? n use 0.2.6
  - aaronblohowiak 16y ago
    Nave plays well with npm, so you can have different sets of libraries for the different versions of node that you have installed (similar to rvm if you're a rubyist.) This is mostly important when you have libraries that are compiled C/C++.

nailer 16y ago

> A specially named directory, node_modules/, is searched in the current directory for any modules. Awesome. Currently NPM expects unprivileged users to have access to /usr/local, and a lot of node tutorials encourage global repermissioning of this directory, which is Bad Unix. Hopefully, once NPM gets updated, you'll have a Python virtualenv/Ruby equivalent style project-specific install system. Update: https://github.com/isaacs/nave https://github.com/isaacs/nave says Nave provides virtualenvs for Node, which may be worth checking out.

jdub 16y ago
npm currently supports ~/.node_modules, by the way (which node has supported for ages)
- coenhyde 16y ago
  But then you are still relying on modules available and their versions on the system where the node app is running. Bundling is a much more reliable way of doing things.
  - jdub 16y ago
    Bundling (and the like) is a necessary evil of ecosystems riding hard on the bleeding edge, like node.js... ... and I would say Ruby/Rails, but they ought to be growing up by now, and integrating sensibly with platform package management. :-) The difference between Python and Ruby on Debian/Ubuntu systems is astounding, and as the node.js ecosystem matures I dearly hope it will look more like the Python world than the unending adolescence of Ruby/Rails.
    - mnutt 16y ago
      I don't think it's really fair to lay all of the blame with node and ruby/rails in this case; the distro package managers are just as much at fault: http://sheddingbikes.com/posts/1285063820.html http://sheddingbikes.com/posts/1285063820.html It really just depends on what you're trying to do. As a desktop user you probably care most about stability; we can't have a python upgrade breaking apt. As a developer it's often important to have an up-to-date version of the tools and libraries you're using.
    - steveklabnik 16y ago
      > the unending adolescence It has nothing to do with adolescence, and everything to do with different priorities. Debian favors stability, Ruby favors breakneck progress. Each has their pros and cons.
- nailer 16y ago

deleted 16y ago

[deleted]

philsalesses 16y ago

I'm starting a new project and I can't wait to see what this thing can do.

arnorhs 16y ago

Which version of v8 was being used in 2.x/3.x ? The v8 change log is very detailed. Anybody got a helicopter view of speed improvements and/or other changes?

bnoordhuis 16y ago
> Which version of v8 was being used in 2.x/3.x ? Several. Since node.js 0.2.0, V8 has been incrementally upgraded from 2.4.2 to 3.1.2. The changelog is here: https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/deps/v8/ChangeLog https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/deps/v8/ChangeLog

ladon86 16y ago

Any word on express.js and connect compatibility?

tjarratt 16y ago
Looking at the recent commits in the last two days, it doesn't look like visionmedia has changed anything for 0.4.0 in particular. If you're interested, you should try it out and file issues appropriately. I'll probably be doing exactly that tonight.
mcantelon 16y ago
Looks like it's a go: http://twitter.com/tjholowaychuk/status/35869375533682688 http://twitter.com/tjholowaychuk/status/35869375533682688

invisible 16y ago

There is still some confusion for me as to whether it's "production ready." Ryan Dahl said for a long time that it wasn't ready for production, but I haven't heard anything like that recently. In fact, I've heard others proclaim they're using it for larger sites just fine (citing poor SSL support as one of the primary drawbacks). I also remember Ryan saying that the memory management within V8 caused a lot of the bugs they were dealing with. So what's the real status of the project in terms of putting it into production?

chapel 16y ago
I don't speek for Ryan Dahl or the community at large, but from what I can tell hanging out in the IRC room and reading the mail list is that it is ready for production for just about anyone. Now mind you, anything this young isn't going to be perfect, but what systems are? As far as I know the SSL issues are fixed or being patched ASAP, so you should be able to get something up and running and feel fairly secure in it 0.4.0 brings quite a few API changes from 0.2.6, so if you haven't been keeping up, you should really scour the API docs. You can also check out the wiki for a guide on migrating. https://github.com/ry/node/wiki/Migrating-from-v0.2-to-v0.3 https://github.com/ry/node/wiki/Migrating-from-v0.2-to-v0.3
gmac 16y ago
I was all set to start a new project on node.js a couple of months ago, but ended up back on Rails. Not because node.js itself seemed flaky, but because libraries were scarce (e.g. anyone know of a credible ORM?) and, where available, often in alpha. This isn't a criticism: it's inevitable in a young platform, and I'd happily help develop the libraries. But it didn't seem a feasible option for a project that (a) had deadlines and (b) needed features beyond the (impressive) node.js core.
- davej 16y ago
  > anyone know of a credible ORM? Node devs tend to take a different approach to Rails/Django in this regard, there's no single ORM with lots of database backends (ala ActiveRecord). This is probably related to the fact that Node devs tend to use tools like Redis, Mongo and Couch rather than traditional relational databases like MySQL and Postgres which all have similar SQL interfaces. There are some really nice libraries and modeling tools available but they're not database agnostic SQL ORMs, for example recently I've been using Mongoose: http://mongoosejs.com/ http://mongoosejs.com/ I've come from the Django world so I empathise with the "How do I do [insert Django/Rails feature here]?" mindset, but a lot of the time the Django/Rails just doesn't work well Node. Node.js is a single-threaded, event-based, non-blocking server; it really is a totally different paradigm so you have to be prepared to rethink the modus operandi for developing web applications.