4 ms·

Or just stop using Facebook and its products.

newscracker 7y ago
I wish more people would do it (though I’ve been advocating for this for a long time). The network effects are still strong, and people are loathe to try another platform that may not serve the same needs. I keep trying to push people away from WhatsApp (somewhat easily, I should say) because there are many alternatives. Instagram is tougher. The newer federated alternatives like Pixelfed aren’t there on features, and they don’t even have a mobile app yet! Facebook groups is another thing that doesn’t have a good enough replacement. In certain cases Facebook remains the best option to reach people. I’m not talking about personal messages or interactions, but about things of value to larger communities focused on social good.
freepor 7y ago
That just doesn’t work. If a local leather tannery is polluting my water supply, I can’t make my water clean by avoiding leather goods.
- mav3rick 7y ago
  All hail false analogies.
puranjay 7y ago
They're invaluable for democracy. Right now, there are a number of anti government, pro democracy protests taking place in my country. All of them are being organized and spread via Instagram and WhatsApp
- ncmncm 7y ago
  They are disastrous for democracy.
  - puranjay 7y ago
    It's more nuanced than that. Did WhatsApp and Facebook help elect right-wing autocrats? Yes. Are WhatsApp and Facebook also helping protestors against right-wing autocrats organize and protest? Also yes.
    - ncmncm 7y ago
      It looks to me like the balance is very, very far to the right.
      - puranjay 7y ago
        True. You can convincingly argue that Facebook et al are a net negative for our society
- JohnJamesRambo 7y ago
  Why could those not be on Signal and be actually safe due to real end-to-end encryption and no spying from Facebook? https://www.forbes.com/sites/parmyolson/2018/09/27/facebook-is-committed-to-whatsapp-encryption-but-could-bypass-it-too/#295b029a3efe https://www.forbes.com/sites/parmyolson/2018/09/27/facebook-...
  - SquishyPanda23 7y ago
    Presumably because Signal doesn't have the install base to make that realistic. I do hope that the people taking real risks are doing their most sensitive communication on something better like Signal. But for mass reach using another tool seems necessary as of now.
  - puranjay 7y ago
    You can't organize a protest if no one knows about it. In order to get the word out, you have to use platforms that everyone already has access to.
peteretep 7y ago
That's about as practical for me as giving up my local water utility as an inner-city dweller. I mean I definitely could. I can get large bottles of potable water delivered quite cheaply, and I guess I could setup a system so that that's what came out of the taps. But what I really want is for the government to intervene so I don't need to give up my local water utility, by guaranteeing minimum levels of service, and providing solid regulation.
- Zhenya 7y ago
  I don't see which Facebook product you can't live without. Facebook? Who needs it! Whatsapp? Signal! Instagram? I don't know... Read something? How are their services like water?!
  - mewpmewp2 7y ago
    There are lots of communities and events that are organized through Facebook. Also lot of my friends are on Facebook and they organize gatherings etc through it.
    - thelittleone 7y ago
      Could you create an empty account with no personally identifiable info and use that to see events? Before deleting FB I deleted the app from phone and used browser only. If I went back it would be as a zero value profile.
      - mewpmewp2 7y ago
        This is already jumping through hoops. If my friends organize birthdays they do it through private FB events and group chats, meaning I would have to still readd all the friends I have. And at that point I am sure my new account could be correlated and linked to my old account. Some groups like my local housing community I would have to explain who I am and give a huge spiel about how I deleted my Facebook account and I am actually X.
    - 7y ago

I wish more people would do it (though I’ve been advocating for this for a long time). The network effects are still strong, and people are loathe to try another platform that may not serve the same needs. I keep trying to push people away from WhatsApp (somewhat easily, I should say) because there are many alternatives. Instagram is tougher. The newer federated alternatives like Pixelfed aren’t there on features, and they don’t even have a mobile app yet! Facebook groups is another thing that doesn’t have a good enough replacement. In certain cases Facebook remains the best option to reach people. I’m not talking about personal messages or interactions, but about things of value to larger communities focused on social good.

freepor 7y ago

That just doesn’t work. If a local leather tannery is polluting my water supply, I can’t make my water clean by avoiding leather goods.

mav3rick 7y ago
All hail false analogies.

puranjay 7y ago

They're invaluable for democracy. Right now, there are a number of anti government, pro democracy protests taking place in my country. All of them are being organized and spread via Instagram and WhatsApp

ncmncm 7y ago
They are disastrous for democracy.
- puranjay 7y ago
  It's more nuanced than that. Did WhatsApp and Facebook help elect right-wing autocrats? Yes. Are WhatsApp and Facebook also helping protestors against right-wing autocrats organize and protest? Also yes.
  - ncmncm 7y ago
    It looks to me like the balance is very, very far to the right.
    - puranjay 7y ago
      True. You can convincingly argue that Facebook et al are a net negative for our society
JohnJamesRambo 7y ago
Why could those not be on Signal and be actually safe due to real end-to-end encryption and no spying from Facebook? https://www.forbes.com/sites/parmyolson/2018/09/27/facebook-is-committed-to-whatsapp-encryption-but-could-bypass-it-too/#295b029a3efe https://www.forbes.com/sites/parmyolson/2018/09/27/facebook-...
- SquishyPanda23 7y ago
  Presumably because Signal doesn't have the install base to make that realistic. I do hope that the people taking real risks are doing their most sensitive communication on something better like Signal. But for mass reach using another tool seems necessary as of now.
- puranjay 7y ago
  You can't organize a protest if no one knows about it. In order to get the word out, you have to use platforms that everyone already has access to.

peteretep 7y ago

That's about as practical for me as giving up my local water utility as an inner-city dweller. I mean I definitely could. I can get large bottles of potable water delivered quite cheaply, and I guess I could setup a system so that that's what came out of the taps. But what I really want is for the government to intervene so I don't need to give up my local water utility, by guaranteeing minimum levels of service, and providing solid regulation.

Zhenya 7y ago
I don't see which Facebook product you can't live without. Facebook? Who needs it! Whatsapp? Signal! Instagram? I don't know... Read something? How are their services like water?!
- mewpmewp2 7y ago
  There are lots of communities and events that are organized through Facebook. Also lot of my friends are on Facebook and they organize gatherings etc through it.
  - thelittleone 7y ago
    Could you create an empty account with no personally identifiable info and use that to see events? Before deleting FB I deleted the app from phone and used browser only. If I went back it would be as a zero value profile.
    - mewpmewp2 7y ago
      This is already jumping through hoops. If my friends organize birthdays they do it through private FB events and group chats, meaning I would have to still readd all the friends I have. And at that point I am sure my new account could be correlated and linked to my old account. Some groups like my local housing community I would have to explain who I am and give a huge spiel about how I deleted my Facebook account and I am actually X.
  - 7y ago