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I was reading the other day that typically mass shootings happen during a recession, and right now is a confusing time because the economy is supposedly doing f

I was reading the other day that typically mass shootings happen during a recession, and right now is a confusing time because the economy is supposedly doing fantastic, yet we keep having mass shootings. Could this have to do with the mounting inequality? It seems the standard indicators for the health of the economy are breaking because wealth just keeps pooling near the top. So what this study could be saying is, "make changes so that more people get the benefits of the booming economy."

opportune 7y ago
My suspicion is yes. Doesn’t much matter if mean economic indicators are trending up while the majority of people are becoming worse-off. I also think social media/internet is to blame for this though, because it makes the realities of economic inequality much more real than just tangentially hearing about celebrities in rags and trashtv.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
lsiebert 7y ago
The market is great, and a lot of money from the trump tax cuts has been used for buybacks that kept prices rising, but wages have stagnated as expenses such as health care, child care, education, etc have all increased rapidly.
- bostonvaulter2 7y ago
  So said another way, the market is great but the average american is the same or worse off.
keiferski 7y ago
This seems pretty reductionist. Every event isn’t attributable to economics.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
MisterBastahrd 7y ago
Those with investments have a much different economic situation than those who don't, to the point that it almost doesn't matter how well the economy is doing for the lowest wealth classes. Minimum wage in a bull economy is the same as minimum wage in bear economy.
deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
hanniabu 7y ago
The economy is only doing great for businesses. Common folk are barely recovered from the recession. So yes, I would say it's definitely due to inequality and a breakdown of indicators.
- Domenic_S 7y ago
  > Common folk are barely recovered from the recession. By what measure?
  - sp332 7y ago
    % change in real mean wealth. https://psmag.com/economics/wealth-inequality-and-the-great-recession https://psmag.com/economics/wealth-inequality-and-the-great-...
    - Domenic_S 7y ago
      When you measure wealth as including home equity, as this article does, this is bound to happen in 2007. I'm not sure it tells us anything meaningful except that home prices were way out of whack and for many people their home is a substantial % of their wealth.
      - dole 7y ago
        Why wouldn't you include home equity into wealth? Perceptible gap widening since 2007: https://www.cbpp.org/research/poverty-and-inequality/a-guide-to-statistics-on-historical-trends-in-income-inequality https://www.cbpp.org/research/poverty-and-inequality/a-guide...
        Domenic_S 7y ago
        Because housing prices were in a bubble fueled by fraud.
        MisterBastahrd 7y ago
sdegutis 7y ago
Fulton Sheen says that to stop violence, we need to resort to violence: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHaizmIj3ck&t=2000s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHaizmIj3ck&t=2000s
taborj 7y ago
If you want to make a significant dent in the mass shooting problem (by the way, the FBI's crime stats page [0] is illuminating on many subjects, not the least of which is that violent crime rates are way down from earlier in the 2000s [1]), you need to start looking at why someone feels shooting up a bunch of innocent people is a valid response to whatever stressor they're feeling. Maybe there is an income inequality, and that can cause someone to feel angry. But there's a leap that needs to be made from "angry" to "mass murderer", and it'd be helpful to understand why that is. I suspect it's mental. [0] https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-2018 https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-... [1] https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-2018/topic-pages/tables/table-1 https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-...
DuskStar 7y ago
> I was reading the other day that typically mass shootings happen during a recession, and right now is a confusing time because the economy is supposedly doing fantastic, yet we keep having mass shootings. This feels like the sort of thing that's really going to depend on the definition of mass shooting used. Inner city African American gang violence is the majority of "3+ killed by gun at once" incidents, and if your definition includes that then that's what you'll be measuring. And on the other hand if you use "2+ unrelated people killed or injured including shooter, not gang related" like some advocacy groups do you'll get different results, and if you use what most people would consider a mass shooting (3+ unrelated people killed in public place not including shooter excluding gang violence, or "something that shows up on national news") you'll have minimal data to go off of since those events happen <10x/yr.

opportune 7y ago

My suspicion is yes. Doesn’t much matter if mean economic indicators are trending up while the majority of people are becoming worse-off. I also think social media/internet is to blame for this though, because it makes the realities of economic inequality much more real than just tangentially hearing about celebrities in rags and trashtv.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

lsiebert 7y ago

The market is great, and a lot of money from the trump tax cuts has been used for buybacks that kept prices rising, but wages have stagnated as expenses such as health care, child care, education, etc have all increased rapidly.

bostonvaulter2 7y ago
So said another way, the market is great but the average american is the same or worse off.

keiferski 7y ago

This seems pretty reductionist. Every event isn’t attributable to economics.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]

MisterBastahrd 7y ago

Those with investments have a much different economic situation than those who don't, to the point that it almost doesn't matter how well the economy is doing for the lowest wealth classes. Minimum wage in a bull economy is the same as minimum wage in bear economy.

deleted 7y ago

[deleted]

hanniabu 7y ago

The economy is only doing great for businesses. Common folk are barely recovered from the recession. So yes, I would say it's definitely due to inequality and a breakdown of indicators.

Domenic_S 7y ago
> Common folk are barely recovered from the recession. By what measure?
- sp332 7y ago
  % change in real mean wealth. https://psmag.com/economics/wealth-inequality-and-the-great-recession https://psmag.com/economics/wealth-inequality-and-the-great-...
  - Domenic_S 7y ago
    When you measure wealth as including home equity, as this article does, this is bound to happen in 2007. I'm not sure it tells us anything meaningful except that home prices were way out of whack and for many people their home is a substantial % of their wealth.
    - dole 7y ago
      Why wouldn't you include home equity into wealth? Perceptible gap widening since 2007: https://www.cbpp.org/research/poverty-and-inequality/a-guide-to-statistics-on-historical-trends-in-income-inequality https://www.cbpp.org/research/poverty-and-inequality/a-guide...
      - Domenic_S 7y ago
        Because housing prices were in a bubble fueled by fraud.
        MisterBastahrd 7y ago

sdegutis 7y ago

Fulton Sheen says that to stop violence, we need to resort to violence: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHaizmIj3ck&t=2000s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHaizmIj3ck&t=2000s

taborj 7y ago

If you want to make a significant dent in the mass shooting problem (by the way, the FBI's crime stats page [0] is illuminating on many subjects, not the least of which is that violent crime rates are way down from earlier in the 2000s [1]), you need to start looking at why someone feels shooting up a bunch of innocent people is a valid response to whatever stressor they're feeling. Maybe there is an income inequality, and that can cause someone to feel angry. But there's a leap that needs to be made from "angry" to "mass murderer", and it'd be helpful to understand why that is. I suspect it's mental. [0] https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-2018 https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-... [1] https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-2018/topic-pages/tables/table-1 https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-...

DuskStar 7y ago

> I was reading the other day that typically mass shootings happen during a recession, and right now is a confusing time because the economy is supposedly doing fantastic, yet we keep having mass shootings. This feels like the sort of thing that's really going to depend on the definition of mass shooting used. Inner city African American gang violence is the majority of "3+ killed by gun at once" incidents, and if your definition includes that then that's what you'll be measuring. And on the other hand if you use "2+ unrelated people killed or injured including shooter, not gang related" like some advocacy groups do you'll get different results, and if you use what most people would consider a mass shooting (3+ unrelated people killed in public place not including shooter excluding gang violence, or "something that shows up on national news") you'll have minimal data to go off of since those events happen <10x/yr.