4 ms·

I’ve seen Java developers completely lost with no idea where to start debugging an installation in a lab environment because they had no IDE, JDK only. Sure, yo

by gbacon 7y ago

I’ve seen Java developers completely lost with no idea where to start debugging an installation in a lab environment because they had no IDE, JDK only. Sure, you might argue that it’s an unlikely scenario, but never say never. CS is one of many fields where having a basic understanding of how things work at least a couple of layers of abstraction down is a good thing, and at least could save potential embarrassment.

filmgirlcw 7y ago
You're not wrong, but I don't see how forcing people to use vim solves this problem. If anything, you risk having a whole class of students who can only do things the vim way. I'll grant you that you're much more likely in a lab environment to have access to a POSIX system so you can use vi or whatever, but you could also wind up in a shop that dictates its devs use a specific IDE. I'm in full-agreement that it's a good thing to have a basic understanding of how stuff works, but I'm not sure how enforcing vim over VSCode or Sublime or [insert your favorite editor] necessarily teaches that. It teaches adherence to vim. I'm of the opinion that programming tools are very personal -- that's why there are so many debates and that's why we'll never have universal agreement. I know my way around the command line and I'll suffer through vim if I have to (it's fine. It's just not my editor of choice), but if I don't have my dotfiles or configurations, I'm not going to be very productive either. I'm fine with saying, "don't use an IDE in my class, use a text editor" -- but I find it draconian and ridiculous to insist upon a specific text editor.
- gbacon 7y ago
  I should have been clear that I lean toward your side of the issue in that a blanket policy for the entire term does seem a bit extreme but completely without value. If I were pushed to defend the instructor’s policy of a particular editor, vi is nearly certain to be on any Unix installation. Not necessarily how I would (or have) done it, but the approach is not without value. My preferred Unix editor is the vi family. I wonder whether emacs people are less sympathetic.

by gbacon 7y ago

filmgirlcw 7y ago

You're not wrong, but I don't see how forcing people to use vim solves this problem. If anything, you risk having a whole class of students who can only do things the vim way. I'll grant you that you're much more likely in a lab environment to have access to a POSIX system so you can use vi or whatever, but you could also wind up in a shop that dictates its devs use a specific IDE. I'm in full-agreement that it's a good thing to have a basic understanding of how stuff works, but I'm not sure how enforcing vim over VSCode or Sublime or [insert your favorite editor] necessarily teaches that. It teaches adherence to vim. I'm of the opinion that programming tools are very personal -- that's why there are so many debates and that's why we'll never have universal agreement. I know my way around the command line and I'll suffer through vim if I have to (it's fine. It's just not my editor of choice), but if I don't have my dotfiles or configurations, I'm not going to be very productive either. I'm fine with saying, "don't use an IDE in my class, use a text editor" -- but I find it draconian and ridiculous to insist upon a specific text editor.

gbacon 7y ago
I should have been clear that I lean toward your side of the issue in that a blanket policy for the entire term does seem a bit extreme but completely without value. If I were pushed to defend the instructor’s policy of a particular editor, vi is nearly certain to be on any Unix installation. Not necessarily how I would (or have) done it, but the approach is not without value. My preferred Unix editor is the vi family. I wonder whether emacs people are less sympathetic.