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I was raided (secret service) thanks to a boneheaded roommate. Woke up to guns drawn and shouting. My advice: * Don't talk to the police * Maintain off site b

I was raided (secret service) thanks to a boneheaded roommate. Woke up to guns drawn and shouting. My advice: * Don't talk to the police * Maintain off site backups because they will take everything, even the whole machine in my case * Encrypt everything, this event really reinforced that for me

andai 7y ago
I've been hearing stories of people being detained for refusing to decrypt their drives. And the author writes: > I was also asked for my password and if I had any encrypted data on my PC
- sevenf0ur 7y ago
  You should first consult with an attorney before making any statement to the police, much less handling over incriminating evidence. I'd rather keep the option open to fight over it in court than just giving up the key and hoping that the police will view it in my favor. Also, encryption is a must in case of theft.
  - withinboredom 7y ago
    In some countries, lying or withholding information is a crime itself. The USA is fairly unique with the "right to remain silent."
    - giancarlostoro 7y ago
      Sometimes saying anything at all might incriminate you because you're the only suspect. Don't talk to cops without a lawyer basically is the way to go in the USA.
      - mikekchar 7y ago
        In Japan, you are currently allowed a lawyer to be present when being questioned, but it wasn't that long ago that you weren't. However, there was a bit of a hack: you were guaranteed to have a translator. It didn't matter how good your Japanese language skills were, you could demand a translator (assuming you spoke another language!) and they had to be present during all interrogation. While not as good as a lawyer, at least you had a witness if something untoward happened during the interrogation (which was apparently quite common in those times). I have heard that since the latest reforms in the last 10 years (lawyers present during questioning and allowance of a trial by jury) the incidence of untoward occurrences has decreased. While police here are an extremely friendly feature in society (very different than any other country I've lived in), you definitely don't want to get on the wrong side of the law one way or the other.
- syshum 7y ago
  The author is also German, thus has less protections than in the US (which would be the case if your raided by the Secret Service)
  - wsy 7y ago
    Which protection in particular is present in US and missing in Germany?
moduspol 7y ago
Also, try really hard to not have your dog present when you get raided.
geek_at 7y ago
Encrypted, Offsite backups are key!
peterwwillis 7y ago
Encrypting everything is a good way to get them to harass you more. First of course they'll compel you to give up the encryption key, so what's the point of encrypting it? Then comes the inevitable lame argument of "if you had nothing to hide, why did you use encryption?!" Encrypt things just for your general privacy (ex. from theft), but against the government, it's counter-productive.
- sevenf0ur 7y ago
  If the police believe you are a suspect in a crime, there is literally nothing you can say or do that will help you. Talking to the police will only hurt you. In the US, key disclosure law is complicated by the 5th amendment. Here's a good example: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/06/massachusetts-high-court-orders-suspect-to-decrypt-his-computers/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/06/massachusetts-hi... > Because Gelfgatt already admitted to police that he owned and controlled the seized computers and had the ability to decrypt them, the court found that the act of decryption would not reveal anything new to the police. Therefore, the act of compelled decryption was not “testimonial.” Normally, the Fifth Amendment privilege prevents the government from forcing a witness to disclose incriminating information in his mind (like a password not written down anywhere else)—but only if that is information the police do not already know. If he had simply made no statements to the police, he might have been able to invoke his 5th amendment right. But now we'll never now.
  - peterwwillis 7y ago
    Oh sure, never say anything without a lawyer, but also don't give them more reasons to harass you.

andai 7y ago

I've been hearing stories of people being detained for refusing to decrypt their drives. And the author writes: > I was also asked for my password and if I had any encrypted data on my PC

sevenf0ur 7y ago
You should first consult with an attorney before making any statement to the police, much less handling over incriminating evidence. I'd rather keep the option open to fight over it in court than just giving up the key and hoping that the police will view it in my favor. Also, encryption is a must in case of theft.
- withinboredom 7y ago
  In some countries, lying or withholding information is a crime itself. The USA is fairly unique with the "right to remain silent."
  - giancarlostoro 7y ago
    Sometimes saying anything at all might incriminate you because you're the only suspect. Don't talk to cops without a lawyer basically is the way to go in the USA.
    - mikekchar 7y ago
      In Japan, you are currently allowed a lawyer to be present when being questioned, but it wasn't that long ago that you weren't. However, there was a bit of a hack: you were guaranteed to have a translator. It didn't matter how good your Japanese language skills were, you could demand a translator (assuming you spoke another language!) and they had to be present during all interrogation. While not as good as a lawyer, at least you had a witness if something untoward happened during the interrogation (which was apparently quite common in those times). I have heard that since the latest reforms in the last 10 years (lawyers present during questioning and allowance of a trial by jury) the incidence of untoward occurrences has decreased. While police here are an extremely friendly feature in society (very different than any other country I've lived in), you definitely don't want to get on the wrong side of the law one way or the other.
syshum 7y ago
The author is also German, thus has less protections than in the US (which would be the case if your raided by the Secret Service)
- wsy 7y ago
  Which protection in particular is present in US and missing in Germany?

moduspol 7y ago

Also, try really hard to not have your dog present when you get raided.

geek_at 7y ago

Encrypted, Offsite backups are key!

peterwwillis 7y ago

Encrypting everything is a good way to get them to harass you more. First of course they'll compel you to give up the encryption key, so what's the point of encrypting it? Then comes the inevitable lame argument of "if you had nothing to hide, why did you use encryption?!" Encrypt things just for your general privacy (ex. from theft), but against the government, it's counter-productive.

sevenf0ur 7y ago
If the police believe you are a suspect in a crime, there is literally nothing you can say or do that will help you. Talking to the police will only hurt you. In the US, key disclosure law is complicated by the 5th amendment. Here's a good example: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/06/massachusetts-high-court-orders-suspect-to-decrypt-his-computers/ https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/06/massachusetts-hi... > Because Gelfgatt already admitted to police that he owned and controlled the seized computers and had the ability to decrypt them, the court found that the act of decryption would not reveal anything new to the police. Therefore, the act of compelled decryption was not “testimonial.” Normally, the Fifth Amendment privilege prevents the government from forcing a witness to disclose incriminating information in his mind (like a password not written down anywhere else)—but only if that is information the police do not already know. If he had simply made no statements to the police, he might have been able to invoke his 5th amendment right. But now we'll never now.
- peterwwillis 7y ago
  Oh sure, never say anything without a lawyer, but also don't give them more reasons to harass you.