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Either they have a children's account (https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338?hl=en https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338?hl=en) Or G

Either they have a children's account (https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338?hl=en https://support.google.com/families/answer/7103338?hl=en) Or Google figures it out the same way they infer any number of things about you and use it to resell advertising. If they can figure out someone is a woman between 19 and 25, I'm pretty sure they can figure out with a good degree of accuracy that a user is under 15.

ouid 7y ago
In a similar vein, if it's illegal to do enough tracking on a 12 year old to identify them as a 12 year old, and 12 year olds exist, then it's illegal to do any tracking, right?
- derefr 7y ago
  You could just turn the negative-detection into positive detection: sell hardware that you have to be 18 to buy, and then provide your service only through that hardware.
  - pkaye 7y ago
    Parents will buy said hardware for their kids.
    - derefr 7y ago
      Well, that's fine, then; with enough clear labelling, that's legally entirely the parents' fault.
      - tssva 7y ago
        Google already requires accounts with a birth date indicating they are 13 or older, thus not subject to COPA, to verify their age via charging a credit card or sending in a copy of a government issued id. Any kids that were watching either stole a credit card or their parents created the account for them. The FTC decided this was not adequate, so I don't expect they would deem your scheme compliant either.
        bagacrap 7y ago
        What? I don't remember sending Google an ID when I last created an account.
      - ggggtez 7y ago
        News flash! They already did buy specialized hardware that you need to be over 18 to buy! It's called a smartphone with a data plan! There is pretty much 0 way that you could say that purchasing a universal communication device is carte blanche for a child to view any content online.
        anticensor 7y ago
        > specialized hardware that you need to be over 18 to buy Not always. Minors are allowed to have cellular with parental consent in some cases.
- ogre_codes 7y ago
  I'm ok with this myself. The web would not stop working (or even noticeably degrade) if all persistent tracking was illegal/ disabled.
- ggggtez 7y ago
  That's not my reading of COPPA (but I'm no lawyer). Just because you can't individually track a user, doesn't mean you can't store a cookie with a single flag for "under13=true" or something like that. COPPA is about personal-information, not pretending children don't exist at all.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
ggggtez 7y ago
As far as I know, no website in the world uses ML to decide that you are under 13. They can't by law, afaik, though ianal. My reading of COPPA is that you need to have the user tell you they are under 13, or via a parent. If you think they are a child based on websites visited, or whatever? That's not "Actual Knowledge" that it's a child.
- Thorrez 7y ago
  That sounds to me exactly like what SuperAwesome's KidSwitch does: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20011860 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20011860

ouid 7y ago

In a similar vein, if it's illegal to do enough tracking on a 12 year old to identify them as a 12 year old, and 12 year olds exist, then it's illegal to do any tracking, right?

derefr 7y ago
You could just turn the negative-detection into positive detection: sell hardware that you have to be 18 to buy, and then provide your service only through that hardware.
- pkaye 7y ago
  Parents will buy said hardware for their kids.
  - derefr 7y ago
    Well, that's fine, then; with enough clear labelling, that's legally entirely the parents' fault.
    - tssva 7y ago
      Google already requires accounts with a birth date indicating they are 13 or older, thus not subject to COPA, to verify their age via charging a credit card or sending in a copy of a government issued id. Any kids that were watching either stole a credit card or their parents created the account for them. The FTC decided this was not adequate, so I don't expect they would deem your scheme compliant either.
      - bagacrap 7y ago
        What? I don't remember sending Google an ID when I last created an account.
    - ggggtez 7y ago
      News flash! They already did buy specialized hardware that you need to be over 18 to buy! It's called a smartphone with a data plan! There is pretty much 0 way that you could say that purchasing a universal communication device is carte blanche for a child to view any content online.
      - anticensor 7y ago
        > specialized hardware that you need to be over 18 to buy Not always. Minors are allowed to have cellular with parental consent in some cases.
ogre_codes 7y ago
I'm ok with this myself. The web would not stop working (or even noticeably degrade) if all persistent tracking was illegal/ disabled.
ggggtez 7y ago
That's not my reading of COPPA (but I'm no lawyer). Just because you can't individually track a user, doesn't mean you can't store a cookie with a single flag for "under13=true" or something like that. COPPA is about personal-information, not pretending children don't exist at all.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]

ggggtez 7y ago

As far as I know, no website in the world uses ML to decide that you are under 13. They can't by law, afaik, though ianal. My reading of COPPA is that you need to have the user tell you they are under 13, or via a parent. If you think they are a child based on websites visited, or whatever? That's not "Actual Knowledge" that it's a child.

Thorrez 7y ago
That sounds to me exactly like what SuperAwesome's KidSwitch does: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20011860 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20011860