5 ms·

Salary negotiation is pretty one sided today with companies holding all the cards. Better visibility into numbers will definitely help level the playing field.

Salary negotiation is pretty one sided today with companies holding all the cards. Better visibility into numbers will definitely help level the playing field. Collecting offer letters is an interesting way to build trust in data. What's the incentive for someone to upload their offer letter though?

eru 7y ago
> Salary negotiation is pretty one sided today with companies holding all the cards. What makes you think companies hold all the cards? Especially in tech.
- chillacy 7y ago
  It's not all the cards but companies (recruiters) usually have information asymmetry on their candidates. Sites like levels.fyi are a good remedy, with the right info and counteroffers you can negotiate salaries/sign-on bonuses up by pretty large amounts.
  - eru 7y ago
    A strategy that has worked for me is to interview in batches. Companies interview multiple candidates, too. That gives you extra leverage and extra information.
    - marvin 7y ago
      I tried this in West Norway recently, being as firm in the negotiation tactics as possible. Didn't yield higher offers at all! So that tells me the market here is actually not nearly as competitive as all the consulting companies try to make people believe. In other words, the success of this strategy is market-dependent, but it certainly seems to have a huge effect in SV.
      - eru 7y ago
        I never worked in SV, but I did mostly work in global cities. It's important to be aware of 'BATNA's, ie the best alternative to negotiated agreement. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_alternative_to_a_negotiated_agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_alternative_to_a_negotiat... For the employer that means hiring the next best candidate, or not hiring anyone for that position. For you it means taking the next best offer, or staying at your old place etc. The concept is closely linked to opportunity costs. In general, you can negotiate an agreement only between your BATNA and their BATNA. (Part of interviewing in batches is that you can credibly present that your BATNA is very high. So you can be tough in negotiations.)
        marvin 7y ago
        Yep, I'm aware of this and use it. I guess in these terms, my claim is that the BATNA of most companies here is actually that they have all the engineers they need at low cost. But are presenting publicly that they have a shortage and more people should become engineers, so that they can get them even cheaper.
      - chillacy 7y ago
        It might be competitive in the other direction: too many engineers, not enough opportunities. Then it becomes a bidding war to see who will accept the least pay.
        eru 7y ago
        Yes, but that's not the industry we work in.
- paxys 7y ago
  Just a few years ago many large silicon valley employers (including some companies on the above list) were part of an illegal anti-poaching agreement and were sued and settled with the DOJ for it. Just because engineers get paid a lot doesn't mean their employers aren't scummy.

eru 7y ago

> Salary negotiation is pretty one sided today with companies holding all the cards. What makes you think companies hold all the cards? Especially in tech.

chillacy 7y ago
It's not all the cards but companies (recruiters) usually have information asymmetry on their candidates. Sites like levels.fyi are a good remedy, with the right info and counteroffers you can negotiate salaries/sign-on bonuses up by pretty large amounts.
- eru 7y ago
  A strategy that has worked for me is to interview in batches. Companies interview multiple candidates, too. That gives you extra leverage and extra information.
  - marvin 7y ago
    I tried this in West Norway recently, being as firm in the negotiation tactics as possible. Didn't yield higher offers at all! So that tells me the market here is actually not nearly as competitive as all the consulting companies try to make people believe. In other words, the success of this strategy is market-dependent, but it certainly seems to have a huge effect in SV.
    - eru 7y ago
      I never worked in SV, but I did mostly work in global cities. It's important to be aware of 'BATNA's, ie the best alternative to negotiated agreement. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_alternative_to_a_negotiated_agreement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_alternative_to_a_negotiat... For the employer that means hiring the next best candidate, or not hiring anyone for that position. For you it means taking the next best offer, or staying at your old place etc. The concept is closely linked to opportunity costs. In general, you can negotiate an agreement only between your BATNA and their BATNA. (Part of interviewing in batches is that you can credibly present that your BATNA is very high. So you can be tough in negotiations.)
      - marvin 7y ago
        Yep, I'm aware of this and use it. I guess in these terms, my claim is that the BATNA of most companies here is actually that they have all the engineers they need at low cost. But are presenting publicly that they have a shortage and more people should become engineers, so that they can get them even cheaper.
    - chillacy 7y ago
      It might be competitive in the other direction: too many engineers, not enough opportunities. Then it becomes a bidding war to see who will accept the least pay.
      - eru 7y ago
        Yes, but that's not the industry we work in.
paxys 7y ago
Just a few years ago many large silicon valley employers (including some companies on the above list) were part of an illegal anti-poaching agreement and were sued and settled with the DOJ for it. Just because engineers get paid a lot doesn't mean their employers aren't scummy.