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Consider the people of California as a group, not as individuals, seen from the federal perspective. They should not be able to evade federal taxes by spending

by burfog 7y ago

Consider the people of California as a group, not as individuals, seen from the federal perspective. They should not be able to evade federal taxes by spending the money on themselves. Double taxation and beyond is the norm. You have sales tax, paid to a vendor that pays their own income tax, for goods that were imported with tariffs. Unless you voted against the California politicians, you should enjoy paying your taxes. Those politicians are why we can't cut expensive government programs at both the state and federal level, and why we must tax heavily to compensate.

arcticbull 7y ago
> Consider the people of California as a group, not as individuals, seen from the federal perspective. They should not be able to evade federal taxes by spending the money on themselves. Nobody's evading anything. The federal, state and local governments together are your government. That's why you've always been able to deduct the local from your state and federal, and state from your federal. In fact I can't think of a country where that's not true, can you? > Double taxation and beyond is the norm. You have sales tax, paid to a vendor that pays their own income tax, for goods that were imported with tariffs. Not with income taxes. Historically not within the United States, and again, as you continue to refuse to address, not for taxes paid to foreign governments. The US has a huge network of no-double-taxation tax treaties with foreign governments because it's not fair to tax people on their taxes. The IRS has a no-double-taxation treaty with Azerbaijan and yet it can't manage to sustain one with California? [1] > Unless you voted against the California politicians, you should enjoy paying your taxes. Those politicians are why we can't cut expensive government programs at both the state and federal level, and why we must tax heavily to compensate. California's top tier is 13.3%, the US federal is 37% + FICA. You can't tell me with a straight face that California's measly tax rate is the reason the US federal government has to charge 40% of both my income and my taxes. I have no problem paying my fair share. I'm also a non-citizen so I can't vote. [1] https://www.irs.gov/businesses/international-businesses/united-states-income-tax-treaties-a-to-z https://www.irs.gov/businesses/international-businesses/unit...
- burfog 7y ago
  The situation with other countries is irrelevant to the matter of California income evading federal taxes. If I'm in Texas, my state income tax is $0. My federal tax rate will be higher without having state taxes to deduct. Part of this money goes to you, in California. If you're in California, you get a reduced federal rate if you can deduct California taxes. The money from California taxes stays in California to benefit you. I do not benefit from your California taxes. California would be getting money from you without paying federal taxes on it. The money then goes to you, via services provided by California. You're getting that money back in the form of superior services like better schools, homeless services, and roads. You're getting to spend that money in your state, free of federal taxes. The deduction is thus a massive subsidy to states with high local taxes. It places a greater burden on states that are less wasteful, since nobody there gets to deduct state taxes. Such a deduction thus encourages wasteful local government. As viewed from outside California, money owed to the federal government is staying in California to be spent for the benefit of people in California. That simply isn't fair. If you are unhappy with the resulting high tax rate, you can leave the state or you can try to get the state to eliminate taxes.
  - arcticbull 7y ago
    Nobody is evading anything lol. > The situation with other countries is irrelevant to the matter of California income evading federal taxes. No it’s very relevant. You’re trying to have it both ways. Either the state represents an arm of the government in which case taxing taxes makes no sense or it’s more akin to a country on its own where you could make the argument double taxation makes sense. But you argue it’s part of the government to the extent it should be contributing to your state but autonomous enough that it should be double taxed. > As viewed from outside California, money owed to the federal government is staying in California to be spent for the benefit of people in California. That simply isn't fair. If you want those services you can move to California. However that money isn’t wasted it’s used to support the people and economy of California which in turn would by itself be the 6th biggest economy in the world. That money is being invested in California and other states benefit from the tax revenue it generates. > If you are unhappy with the resulting high tax rate, you can leave the state or you can try to get the state to eliminate taxes. No haha I’m good, then I wouldn’t live in California where the state invests in its people (to an extent). You can perform all the mental gymnastics you want to justify this but I think you’d feel differently if a democratic administration wanted to tax the tax revenue paid by oil companies or lord help us carbon. This was done plain and simple to own the libs on the coast. Anything else is backing out a justification and fighting for double taxation isn’t a good look.

by burfog 7y ago

arcticbull 7y ago

> Consider the people of California as a group, not as individuals, seen from the federal perspective. They should not be able to evade federal taxes by spending the money on themselves. Nobody's evading anything. The federal, state and local governments together are your government. That's why you've always been able to deduct the local from your state and federal, and state from your federal. In fact I can't think of a country where that's not true, can you? > Double taxation and beyond is the norm. You have sales tax, paid to a vendor that pays their own income tax, for goods that were imported with tariffs. Not with income taxes. Historically not within the United States, and again, as you continue to refuse to address, not for taxes paid to foreign governments. The US has a huge network of no-double-taxation tax treaties with foreign governments because it's not fair to tax people on their taxes. The IRS has a no-double-taxation treaty with Azerbaijan and yet it can't manage to sustain one with California? [1] > Unless you voted against the California politicians, you should enjoy paying your taxes. Those politicians are why we can't cut expensive government programs at both the state and federal level, and why we must tax heavily to compensate. California's top tier is 13.3%, the US federal is 37% + FICA. You can't tell me with a straight face that California's measly tax rate is the reason the US federal government has to charge 40% of both my income and my taxes. I have no problem paying my fair share. I'm also a non-citizen so I can't vote. [1] https://www.irs.gov/businesses/international-businesses/united-states-income-tax-treaties-a-to-z https://www.irs.gov/businesses/international-businesses/unit...

burfog 7y ago
The situation with other countries is irrelevant to the matter of California income evading federal taxes. If I'm in Texas, my state income tax is $0. My federal tax rate will be higher without having state taxes to deduct. Part of this money goes to you, in California. If you're in California, you get a reduced federal rate if you can deduct California taxes. The money from California taxes stays in California to benefit you. I do not benefit from your California taxes. California would be getting money from you without paying federal taxes on it. The money then goes to you, via services provided by California. You're getting that money back in the form of superior services like better schools, homeless services, and roads. You're getting to spend that money in your state, free of federal taxes. The deduction is thus a massive subsidy to states with high local taxes. It places a greater burden on states that are less wasteful, since nobody there gets to deduct state taxes. Such a deduction thus encourages wasteful local government. As viewed from outside California, money owed to the federal government is staying in California to be spent for the benefit of people in California. That simply isn't fair. If you are unhappy with the resulting high tax rate, you can leave the state or you can try to get the state to eliminate taxes.
- arcticbull 7y ago
  Nobody is evading anything lol. > The situation with other countries is irrelevant to the matter of California income evading federal taxes. No it’s very relevant. You’re trying to have it both ways. Either the state represents an arm of the government in which case taxing taxes makes no sense or it’s more akin to a country on its own where you could make the argument double taxation makes sense. But you argue it’s part of the government to the extent it should be contributing to your state but autonomous enough that it should be double taxed. > As viewed from outside California, money owed to the federal government is staying in California to be spent for the benefit of people in California. That simply isn't fair. If you want those services you can move to California. However that money isn’t wasted it’s used to support the people and economy of California which in turn would by itself be the 6th biggest economy in the world. That money is being invested in California and other states benefit from the tax revenue it generates. > If you are unhappy with the resulting high tax rate, you can leave the state or you can try to get the state to eliminate taxes. No haha I’m good, then I wouldn’t live in California where the state invests in its people (to an extent). You can perform all the mental gymnastics you want to justify this but I think you’d feel differently if a democratic administration wanted to tax the tax revenue paid by oil companies or lord help us carbon. This was done plain and simple to own the libs on the coast. Anything else is backing out a justification and fighting for double taxation isn’t a good look.