6 ms·

Legitimately asking - what can the PM do to help the situation? What would he have done for the fires had he not gone on holiday?

by brink 7y ago

agumonkey 7y ago
pragmatism is nice but the goal of government is not only to affect the problem, moral support, presence is critical IMO
gbear605 7y ago
Regardless, it still looks bad. Captain goes down with their ship and all.
bronco21016 7y ago
Yea I see people make arguments like this all the time. We frequently get news articles about leaders who aren’t in the capital legislating/leading despite the fact that these people never really escape their work even if they do travel. The PM isn’t going to do much of anything at this point. The time for the PM to act is prior to the fires starting.
math 7y ago
Australia are introducing very harsh laws targeting climate / environmental activists. He could start by reversing those. E.g. Tasmania, up to 21 year jail term for trespass.
- thrower123 7y ago
  Possibly not a bad idea when so many brushfires are being started by deliberate arson.
  - arcticbull 7y ago
    Yes I’m sure those fire clouds are the work of environmentalists.
    - thrower123 7y ago
      https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/news-life/understanding-an-arsonists-motives-may-help-stop-future-fires/news-story/0eebd6a2ea1a726126df38ca2ce8fb56 https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/news-life/unders...
      - throwlaplace 7y ago
        your nonsense is falsified in your own source >However, there’s a simple reason she can’t confirm that estimate – because “there’s very little research on arsonists worldwide someone mentioned on Reddit that people were attributing these fires to arson and I was incredulous. but here we are
      - arethuza 7y ago
        Why would someone who is prepared to commit arson be deterred by laws on trespassing?
      - fwsgonzo 7y ago
        One of Australias most prominent features is its captured media. They will write just about anything about the climate and people who care about it. I've already seen it all, and that article is nothing spectacular when it comes to inventing boogeymen. After all, the 40C+ temperatures obviously didn't start the fires.
        chris_wot 7y ago
        Yes, yes they did. The extended dry period meant that fuel reduction efforts were hampered all year round. This caused the intensity and increased destruction of the fires.
        fwsgonzo 7y ago
        It was sarcastic, so we both agree I think.
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
Spooky23 7y ago
Part of the role of being a leader is... leading. The presence of top elected officials reassures the public that somebody is in charge and gives a shit about about what is happening. When a leader goes off on vacation while some event happens, it puts off the impression that the government is ineffective and out of touch. It undermines the people on the ground who perhaps are doing something. Also, in terms of "What would he have done for the fires", there are any number of things. The gravitas of having the man on top demanding action ensures that things happen quickly. As a trivial example, if the Assistant Deputy Commissioner of Brush Fire Extinguishing needs X, he'll get it when the truck or helicopter is available. When the PM needs it, the truck or helicopter is made available, period. Or it could be as simple as giving some sort of speech in your crisis windbreaker to rally the troops.
discordance 7y ago
I don’t expect a CEO of a startup or corp to squash bugs or submit PRs, and similarly I don’t expect a PM to literally put fires out. I do expect him to show leadership in times of crisis, bring unity, and just ‘be there’, especially when so many volunteers are fighting the fires and his countrymen are dying and losing their homes.
pjc50 7y ago
Admit that Australian coal extraction is unsustainable and then resign? Admittedly that does nothing for these fires, but without some change future ones are going to be worse. Bringing that lump of coal into Parliament was a declaration that he wasn't going to care if Australia burnt to the ground so long as he got his share of the coal money. https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/feb/09/scott-morrison-brings-coal-to-question-time-what-fresh-idiocy-is-this https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/feb/09/scott...
- pnako 7y ago
  Australia is about 1% of global CO2 emissions. I'm not arguing for being careless, of course, but either way it's not going to change much.
  - Analemma_ 7y ago
    Australia supplies a large fraction of the coal burned by Japan, China, Korea and India. Mentioning the CO2 emissions of Australia itself is missing the point completely.
    - benologist 7y ago
      We are the largest global exporter of coal with over two hundred million tonnes sent to other countries to burn last year. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/mar/29/chinas-policies-put-australias-5bn-coal-export-earnings-at-risk https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/mar/29/chinas-p...
    - pnako 7y ago
      Maybe run on a platform of banning coal exports, or vote for someone running on that platform. Good luck!
      - chris_wot 7y ago
        We are probably going to have to transition, because the world will make this happen for us shortly.
danharaj 7y ago
Not reject international assistance.
- antod 7y ago
  Is that the case this time? I was wondering why I hadn't seen the usual local (NZ) news coverage of fire fighters being sent across the Tasman. It was becoming a regular story for the last few summers.
everdev 7y ago
Leadership. It doesn't mean you're fighting the fires but it does mean you're staying informed, keeping people motivated through long hours and bad news and ready to make difficult decisions.

Legitimately asking - what can the PM do to help the situation? What would he have done for the fires had he not gone on holiday?

by brink 7y ago

Legitimately asking - what can the PM do to help the situation? What would he have done for the fires had he not gone on holiday?

agumonkey 7y ago

pragmatism is nice but the goal of government is not only to affect the problem, moral support, presence is critical IMO

gbear605 7y ago

Regardless, it still looks bad. Captain goes down with their ship and all.

bronco21016 7y ago

Yea I see people make arguments like this all the time. We frequently get news articles about leaders who aren’t in the capital legislating/leading despite the fact that these people never really escape their work even if they do travel. The PM isn’t going to do much of anything at this point. The time for the PM to act is prior to the fires starting.

math 7y ago

Australia are introducing very harsh laws targeting climate / environmental activists. He could start by reversing those. E.g. Tasmania, up to 21 year jail term for trespass.

thrower123 7y ago
Possibly not a bad idea when so many brushfires are being started by deliberate arson.
- arcticbull 7y ago
  Yes I’m sure those fire clouds are the work of environmentalists.
  - thrower123 7y ago
    https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/news-life/understanding-an-arsonists-motives-may-help-stop-future-fires/news-story/0eebd6a2ea1a726126df38ca2ce8fb56 https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/news-life/unders...
    - throwlaplace 7y ago
      your nonsense is falsified in your own source >However, there’s a simple reason she can’t confirm that estimate – because “there’s very little research on arsonists worldwide someone mentioned on Reddit that people were attributing these fires to arson and I was incredulous. but here we are
    - arethuza 7y ago
      Why would someone who is prepared to commit arson be deterred by laws on trespassing?
    - fwsgonzo 7y ago
      One of Australias most prominent features is its captured media. They will write just about anything about the climate and people who care about it. I've already seen it all, and that article is nothing spectacular when it comes to inventing boogeymen. After all, the 40C+ temperatures obviously didn't start the fires.
      - chris_wot 7y ago
        Yes, yes they did. The extended dry period meant that fuel reduction efforts were hampered all year round. This caused the intensity and increased destruction of the fires.
        fwsgonzo 7y ago
        It was sarcastic, so we both agree I think.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]

Spooky23 7y ago

Part of the role of being a leader is... leading. The presence of top elected officials reassures the public that somebody is in charge and gives a shit about about what is happening. When a leader goes off on vacation while some event happens, it puts off the impression that the government is ineffective and out of touch. It undermines the people on the ground who perhaps are doing something. Also, in terms of "What would he have done for the fires", there are any number of things. The gravitas of having the man on top demanding action ensures that things happen quickly. As a trivial example, if the Assistant Deputy Commissioner of Brush Fire Extinguishing needs X, he'll get it when the truck or helicopter is available. When the PM needs it, the truck or helicopter is made available, period. Or it could be as simple as giving some sort of speech in your crisis windbreaker to rally the troops.

discordance 7y ago

I don’t expect a CEO of a startup or corp to squash bugs or submit PRs, and similarly I don’t expect a PM to literally put fires out. I do expect him to show leadership in times of crisis, bring unity, and just ‘be there’, especially when so many volunteers are fighting the fires and his countrymen are dying and losing their homes.

pjc50 7y ago

Admit that Australian coal extraction is unsustainable and then resign? Admittedly that does nothing for these fires, but without some change future ones are going to be worse. Bringing that lump of coal into Parliament was a declaration that he wasn't going to care if Australia burnt to the ground so long as he got his share of the coal money. https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/feb/09/scott-morrison-brings-coal-to-question-time-what-fresh-idiocy-is-this https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/feb/09/scott...

pnako 7y ago
Australia is about 1% of global CO2 emissions. I'm not arguing for being careless, of course, but either way it's not going to change much.
- Analemma_ 7y ago
  Australia supplies a large fraction of the coal burned by Japan, China, Korea and India. Mentioning the CO2 emissions of Australia itself is missing the point completely.
  - benologist 7y ago
    We are the largest global exporter of coal with over two hundred million tonnes sent to other countries to burn last year. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/mar/29/chinas-policies-put-australias-5bn-coal-export-earnings-at-risk https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/mar/29/chinas-p...
  - pnako 7y ago
    Maybe run on a platform of banning coal exports, or vote for someone running on that platform. Good luck!
    - chris_wot 7y ago
      We are probably going to have to transition, because the world will make this happen for us shortly.

danharaj 7y ago

Not reject international assistance.

antod 7y ago
Is that the case this time? I was wondering why I hadn't seen the usual local (NZ) news coverage of fire fighters being sent across the Tasman. It was becoming a regular story for the last few summers.

everdev 7y ago

Leadership. It doesn't mean you're fighting the fires but it does mean you're staying informed, keeping people motivated through long hours and bad news and ready to make difficult decisions.