4 ms·

Not good. But predictable, given the current situation. Putin has quite the grudge, it seems.

rainworld 7y ago
If you want to understand Putin and Russia start with this ARTE documentary from 2005: [0]. Continue with [1] (three parts). [0]: https://youtu.be/oLNKqbwec0s https://youtu.be/oLNKqbwec0s [1]: https://youtu.be/ZLPxyDlQfBc https://youtu.be/ZLPxyDlQfBc
- mirimir 7y ago
  That's all later stuff. And who made those videos? I don't see any organizational affiliation. So I suspect propaganda, of one sort or another.
  - rainworld 7y ago
    >And who made those videos? ARTE (Franco-German public broadcaster) [0] and the BBC [1]. Back when they weren’t fighting Cold War II. [0]: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1182322/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1182322/ [1]: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0811050/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0811050/
  - eesmith 7y ago
    The first one starts "Hello. Welcome to Human Edge. I'm Ian Brown." Human Edge is a Canadian television series - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Edge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Edge Ian Brown is a Canadian journalist - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Brown_(journalist) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Brown_(journalist)
eesmith 7y ago
Isn't it a predicable consequence of MADD, rather than specifically due to any grudges that Putin might have? As I understand it, the goal of MADD is to prevent a preemptive first strike by having an effective second-strike method?. Eg, supercavitating nuclear torpedoes are not useful in a preemptive first strike as they can only take out port cities and spread fallout downwind. But they are an effective second strike weapon as they are impossible to intercept, so make it harder for the US decide to attack.
- mirimir 7y ago
  I'm sort of joking about Putin. But he is rather an archetype of Russian nationalism, no? For maybe a couple decades, it seemed possible that the Cold War was over. But I guess that was an illusion.
  - eesmith 7y ago
    It doesn't help that we (the US) continued to improve our weapons systems - both offensive and defensive - as if the Cold War were still going on.
    - mirimir 7y ago
      Which is sort of my point.
      - eesmith 7y ago
        I couldn't tell from what you wrote what you regarded as the source of the illusion. Since you earlier pointed to Putin's grudges, I thought you meant that Russia's new weapons development programs (post-2000) broke the illusion.
        mirimir 7y ago
        Sorry to be unclear. When the USSR collapsed, the US could have been gracious. Although there was some show of that, overall the US was aggressive, vindictive and disrespectful toward Russia. From what I've read, Yeltsin took it very hard, and drank himself to death. And then his protégé Putin came to power. Whose family had died during the siege of Leningrad, and who had watched his mentor drink himself to death. At that point, Cold War II was ~unavoidable.

If you want to understand Putin and Russia start with this ARTE documentary from 2005: [0]. Continue with [1] (three parts). [0]: https://youtu.be/oLNKqbwec0s https://youtu.be/oLNKqbwec0s [1]: https://youtu.be/ZLPxyDlQfBc https://youtu.be/ZLPxyDlQfBc

mirimir 7y ago
That's all later stuff. And who made those videos? I don't see any organizational affiliation. So I suspect propaganda, of one sort or another.
- rainworld 7y ago
  >And who made those videos? ARTE (Franco-German public broadcaster) [0] and the BBC [1]. Back when they weren’t fighting Cold War II. [0]: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1182322/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1182322/ [1]: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0811050/ https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0811050/
- eesmith 7y ago
  The first one starts "Hello. Welcome to Human Edge. I'm Ian Brown." Human Edge is a Canadian television series - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Edge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Edge Ian Brown is a Canadian journalist - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Brown_(journalist) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Brown_(journalist)

eesmith 7y ago

Isn't it a predicable consequence of MADD, rather than specifically due to any grudges that Putin might have? As I understand it, the goal of MADD is to prevent a preemptive first strike by having an effective second-strike method?. Eg, supercavitating nuclear torpedoes are not useful in a preemptive first strike as they can only take out port cities and spread fallout downwind. But they are an effective second strike weapon as they are impossible to intercept, so make it harder for the US decide to attack.

mirimir 7y ago
I'm sort of joking about Putin. But he is rather an archetype of Russian nationalism, no? For maybe a couple decades, it seemed possible that the Cold War was over. But I guess that was an illusion.
- eesmith 7y ago
  It doesn't help that we (the US) continued to improve our weapons systems - both offensive and defensive - as if the Cold War were still going on.
  - mirimir 7y ago
    Which is sort of my point.
    - eesmith 7y ago
      I couldn't tell from what you wrote what you regarded as the source of the illusion. Since you earlier pointed to Putin's grudges, I thought you meant that Russia's new weapons development programs (post-2000) broke the illusion.
      - mirimir 7y ago
        Sorry to be unclear. When the USSR collapsed, the US could have been gracious. Although there was some show of that, overall the US was aggressive, vindictive and disrespectful toward Russia. From what I've read, Yeltsin took it very hard, and drank himself to death. And then his protégé Putin came to power. Whose family had died during the siege of Leningrad, and who had watched his mentor drink himself to death. At that point, Cold War II was ~unavoidable.