5 ms·

Okay fine. As long as we're not believing announcements, then Rivian’s prices are promotional too. And so are the specs. So this conversation is pointless.

DaiPlusPlus 7y ago
Part of me wants to believe Elon et al. at Tesla has a soft-spot for Rivian and - yes - while the Cybertruck could crush Rivian - they want to see Rivian succeed because an EV monopoly over all vehicle classes might mean an own-goal for combating global climate change: competition is important, and the appearance of competition even more-so.
- clouddrover 7y ago
  If Tesla's priority was combating global climate change then Tesla would open its chargers to all EVs. Other charging networks charge all EVs (including Tesla cars) whereas Tesla's charging network only charges Teslas. Tesla's lack of reciprocity is disappointing.
  - jsight 7y ago
    Tesla has said that they are willing to do so, just not for free. I also get the impression that they don't want every slow-charging electric vehicle to have access to their network, and I honestly can't blame them. They have capacity issues as it is, it would be much worse if slow-charging Bolts were able to use it. Its the early days still, though, so hopefully this will change as Tesla's competitors become more competitive.
    - clouddrover 7y ago
      Tesla only has capacity problems in North America because they've stuck with a proprietary plug. If they switch to CCS and provide a CCS adapter for older cars then their capacity problems will be solved. There don't need to be any special deals for them to open their network to other EVs. Tesla can just keep the old proprietary plug on their chargers, add on a CCS plug as well, and get on with it.
      - jsight 7y ago
        I see people say this online from time to time, but I see very little evidence for it. The Madonna Inn charger was clogged with traffic yesterday, despite it being a massive charger relative to what the other US networks have built. Is there any indication that there are other companies wanting to open up massive charging stations along this route and are simply being held up by Tesla? I can't see evidence of that. It isn't like there are massive waves of EA chargers available along the way. Granted, the Tesla owners with Chademo adapters often did ok, but that was mostly because so few bothered to buy or use them. The available options would have been just as overwhelmed if more owners used them. Around here, we are actually have some issues with hotels being hostile towards Tesla owners and Tesla having issues finding properties to place chargers.
        clouddrover 7y ago
        > The Madonna Inn charger was clogged with traffic yesterday You'd plan a different route if there was access to other chargers. There's an EVgo site 5 km from the Madonna Inn. An Electrify America site is going in 19 km from that site. Electrify America is adding new sites every week at the moment. EVgo is adding a Tesla plug to their chargers. It's essentially a built-in CHAdeMO adapter. It's dumb having to support three different plugs. The sooner it gets to one plug the better. Europe has taken the correct approach by setting CCS type 2 Combo as the standard plug for all cars and chargers. > Around here, we are actually have some issues with hotels being hostile towards Tesla owners and Tesla having issues finding properties to place chargers. All the more reason to spread the work around to multiple companies.
      - kwhitefoot 7y ago
        Tesla Superchargers in Europe already have CCS plugs because that is what the Model 3 uses here (no idea what connector they use in the US) and it is possible to order an adaptor for CCS from Tesla to be used on the Model S and X; unfortunately it requires a new socket on the car as well so it's not cheap. So if other manufacturers wanted to use Tesla's chargers they just have to ask Tesla, pay their way, and help expand the network. At least that is what Tesla is rumoured to be willing to do.

DaiPlusPlus 7y ago

Part of me wants to believe Elon et al. at Tesla has a soft-spot for Rivian and - yes - while the Cybertruck could crush Rivian - they want to see Rivian succeed because an EV monopoly over all vehicle classes might mean an own-goal for combating global climate change: competition is important, and the appearance of competition even more-so.

clouddrover 7y ago
If Tesla's priority was combating global climate change then Tesla would open its chargers to all EVs. Other charging networks charge all EVs (including Tesla cars) whereas Tesla's charging network only charges Teslas. Tesla's lack of reciprocity is disappointing.
- jsight 7y ago
  Tesla has said that they are willing to do so, just not for free. I also get the impression that they don't want every slow-charging electric vehicle to have access to their network, and I honestly can't blame them. They have capacity issues as it is, it would be much worse if slow-charging Bolts were able to use it. Its the early days still, though, so hopefully this will change as Tesla's competitors become more competitive.
  - clouddrover 7y ago
    Tesla only has capacity problems in North America because they've stuck with a proprietary plug. If they switch to CCS and provide a CCS adapter for older cars then their capacity problems will be solved. There don't need to be any special deals for them to open their network to other EVs. Tesla can just keep the old proprietary plug on their chargers, add on a CCS plug as well, and get on with it.
    - jsight 7y ago
      I see people say this online from time to time, but I see very little evidence for it. The Madonna Inn charger was clogged with traffic yesterday, despite it being a massive charger relative to what the other US networks have built. Is there any indication that there are other companies wanting to open up massive charging stations along this route and are simply being held up by Tesla? I can't see evidence of that. It isn't like there are massive waves of EA chargers available along the way. Granted, the Tesla owners with Chademo adapters often did ok, but that was mostly because so few bothered to buy or use them. The available options would have been just as overwhelmed if more owners used them. Around here, we are actually have some issues with hotels being hostile towards Tesla owners and Tesla having issues finding properties to place chargers.
      - clouddrover 7y ago
        > The Madonna Inn charger was clogged with traffic yesterday You'd plan a different route if there was access to other chargers. There's an EVgo site 5 km from the Madonna Inn. An Electrify America site is going in 19 km from that site. Electrify America is adding new sites every week at the moment. EVgo is adding a Tesla plug to their chargers. It's essentially a built-in CHAdeMO adapter. It's dumb having to support three different plugs. The sooner it gets to one plug the better. Europe has taken the correct approach by setting CCS type 2 Combo as the standard plug for all cars and chargers. > Around here, we are actually have some issues with hotels being hostile towards Tesla owners and Tesla having issues finding properties to place chargers. All the more reason to spread the work around to multiple companies.
    - kwhitefoot 7y ago
      Tesla Superchargers in Europe already have CCS plugs because that is what the Model 3 uses here (no idea what connector they use in the US) and it is possible to order an adaptor for CCS from Tesla to be used on the Model S and X; unfortunately it requires a new socket on the car as well so it's not cheap. So if other manufacturers wanted to use Tesla's chargers they just have to ask Tesla, pay their way, and help expand the network. At least that is what Tesla is rumoured to be willing to do.