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Disclaimer: I don't have a degree and I've had a very successful career as software engineer so far. I think the concept of university is mostly a time waste a

Disclaimer: I don't have a degree and I've had a very successful career as software engineer so far. I think the concept of university is mostly a time waste and the reasons for it is: - University is the concept of someone teaching you a topic and then you being able to claim you are qualified in this topic. However, people nowadays need to train themselves in complete new fields multiple times in their lifetime and therefore we already have to teach ourselvs new things all the time and be able to proof that we are qualified in something without a university degree. So why a degree in the first place? - Before we had the internet, digital books, online training courses and other learning materials at our fingertips one had to go to a different physical location packed with other students and learn a subject at a slower pace so that everyone could equally follow the topic. Today this is a waste of time. If one has access to all the learning materials themselves, then they can consume it at their own pace, possibly learn a 3 year course in a single year. Why slow yourself down unnecessarily? - Experience > degree. After the first 2-4 years of work experience nobody cares anymore about your initial degree, unless it's medicine or law. Once you've worked, people are interested in your actual ability to deliver and after 2-4 years there's enough data to convince someone how good you are. - The more people have a degree, the less it's something which makes you stand out. I believe that being different is the best way to stand out from a crowded and competitive market, no matter how. Basically you want to be part of the minority. If nobody has a degree, you want to have a degree, if everybody has a degree, then you don't. People like to see something special in other people, if you can convince them that you know something without going through a lengthy programm like everybody else, then people will think you are smarter or something like that (even if it's not true). This only works though if your in the minority. It's the same pshycology which allows one person to charge 300% more than competitors and having the largest share of customers, because they think that there's something inherently better about it. - In many countries attending university means creating debt. There's good debt and there's bad debt. If I take credit to buy a property which has very high and real chances of drastically increasing in value, then it's good debt, but if I take credit in order to learn something which I can learn myself and which after 2-4 years won't even matter anymore, then it's possible very bad debt. I know someone who paid 150k for an MBA at a business school and I think the money was wasted. If you pay 150k on an MBA in business, then clearly the course material will be entirely wasted on you. 150k is good money that could have been spent so much better in other areas, like buying property and then see the value grow whilst receiving passive income through rent or investing in an actual business which you want to create after the MBA.

vharuck 7y ago
> University is the concept of someone teaching you a topic and then you being able to claim you are qualified in this topic. University is supposed to be learning from the experience of experts. Having a person with experience on hand cuts down the time needed to learn things. Online articles and tutorials aren't a dialogue. Online forums are good, but often can't promise somebody will care about your education. Universities have staff who are paid to teach, talk with, and answer you. That's not to say you're wrong about the value of universities in practice. Kids are told to focus on reviewing textbooks with other students in the same class, getting high grades, and graduating with a degree. People say "visit professors during office hours," but don't stress that this is part of the most valuable thing in a university: an expert who is required to help you learn the field. > Experience > degree. After the first 2-4 years of work experience nobody cares anymore about your initial degree, unless it's medicine or law. Assuming a similar skill level. But a student can leave a 4-year university with a higher skill level than somebody who learned on the job for 4 years. Those people usually just have time to learn about the job they have, so they might take longer to gain skills for the next rung on the career ladder.
- dustinmoris 7y ago
  I respectfully disagree with all your points. Unless you are privileged enough to attend an ivy league university you will not be taught by experts of a field. The majority of university teachers across the world are average people of average skill who often failed to achieve success in the open market and then defaulted back into a comfy uni job. Also there’s no evidence for your claim that 4 years university get you better skilled than 4 years of self disciplined learning and work experience. Maybe you went to a top university in the states but with all respect these universities are not even a fraction of what the average student experienced in every other university. EDIT: btw i went to uni in Europe, but never finished due to the reasons which I mentioned above, so i’ve got some experience what uni life is.
  - vharuck 7y ago
    I've taken classes at two small private colleges and a community college in the US (total of seven years, mostly part-time, for an undergraduate). None were on the usual elite list. But you're right that I don't know much about universities in other countries. >Unless you are privileged enough to attend an ivy league university you will not be taught by experts of a field. The majority of university teachers across the world are average people of average skill Average skill of an expert in the field is good enough. Not an "expert among experts," but an expert nonetheless. And most people will end up as experts of average skill, so that's fine. I majored in math, and all my professors knew more about the subject, knew how it was used, and had their own research going on. Again, not an elite college, so they weren't big projects, but these people weren't just failures who found a cushy job. As a student, "more skilled than me" is all I needed. Anything they knew beyond what I should learn in college wasn't useful to me. It only mattered they knew how to teach it to me. >Also there’s no evidence for your claim that 4 years university get you better skilled than 4 years of self disciplined learning and work experience. Alright, you got me there. Do you have links to non-anecdotal and contrary evidence? Otherwise, I'm going study-hunting.

vharuck 7y ago

> University is the concept of someone teaching you a topic and then you being able to claim you are qualified in this topic. University is supposed to be learning from the experience of experts. Having a person with experience on hand cuts down the time needed to learn things. Online articles and tutorials aren't a dialogue. Online forums are good, but often can't promise somebody will care about your education. Universities have staff who are paid to teach, talk with, and answer you. That's not to say you're wrong about the value of universities in practice. Kids are told to focus on reviewing textbooks with other students in the same class, getting high grades, and graduating with a degree. People say "visit professors during office hours," but don't stress that this is part of the most valuable thing in a university: an expert who is required to help you learn the field. > Experience > degree. After the first 2-4 years of work experience nobody cares anymore about your initial degree, unless it's medicine or law. Assuming a similar skill level. But a student can leave a 4-year university with a higher skill level than somebody who learned on the job for 4 years. Those people usually just have time to learn about the job they have, so they might take longer to gain skills for the next rung on the career ladder.

dustinmoris 7y ago
I respectfully disagree with all your points. Unless you are privileged enough to attend an ivy league university you will not be taught by experts of a field. The majority of university teachers across the world are average people of average skill who often failed to achieve success in the open market and then defaulted back into a comfy uni job. Also there’s no evidence for your claim that 4 years university get you better skilled than 4 years of self disciplined learning and work experience. Maybe you went to a top university in the states but with all respect these universities are not even a fraction of what the average student experienced in every other university. EDIT: btw i went to uni in Europe, but never finished due to the reasons which I mentioned above, so i’ve got some experience what uni life is.
- vharuck 7y ago
  I've taken classes at two small private colleges and a community college in the US (total of seven years, mostly part-time, for an undergraduate). None were on the usual elite list. But you're right that I don't know much about universities in other countries. >Unless you are privileged enough to attend an ivy league university you will not be taught by experts of a field. The majority of university teachers across the world are average people of average skill Average skill of an expert in the field is good enough. Not an "expert among experts," but an expert nonetheless. And most people will end up as experts of average skill, so that's fine. I majored in math, and all my professors knew more about the subject, knew how it was used, and had their own research going on. Again, not an elite college, so they weren't big projects, but these people weren't just failures who found a cushy job. As a student, "more skilled than me" is all I needed. Anything they knew beyond what I should learn in college wasn't useful to me. It only mattered they knew how to teach it to me. >Also there’s no evidence for your claim that 4 years university get you better skilled than 4 years of self disciplined learning and work experience. Alright, you got me there. Do you have links to non-anecdotal and contrary evidence? Otherwise, I'm going study-hunting.