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Netflix's UI is designed to: 1) obfuscate its surprisingly shallow library 2) encourage user interaction (more telemetry data) 3) promote Netflix original co

Netflix's UI is designed to: 1) obfuscate its surprisingly shallow library 2) encourage user interaction (more telemetry data) 3) promote Netflix original content As a user, I don't want any of this. A small cottage industry of alternative Netflix UIs has popped up, because sometimes you just want some good old fashioned filters and sorts. A few examples: https://flixable.com/ https://flixable.com/ https://www.justwatch.com/ https://www.justwatch.com/ https://instantwatcher.com/ https://instantwatcher.com/

usrusr 7y ago
> 3) promote Netflix original content You have no idea how much I prefer this over the dominant competing model which is "promote content that costs extra because it is not actually included in the subscription I already pay". Netflix at least is trying to make me satisfied with the content available, instead of making me yearn for more in order to upsell.
- bootloop 7y ago
  There is no such thing on Netflix as there is nothing to pay extra for. They just try to avoid you canceling your subscription when their licensing agreements are not getting renewed and everything else except their original content is gone.
  - jessaustin 7y ago
    This phenomenon definitely exists on competitors e.g. Prime. Lots of screen space wasted on PPV stuff...
    - yoz-y 7y ago
      Prime has PPV? It that a US thing? In France it only shows content directly available. Amazon originals are often promoted first.
      - jessaustin 7y ago
        Originals are often promoted, and maybe I'm using the wrong acronym with "PPV", but if you click on anything that doesn't have a tiny "prime" ribbon in the corner, you'll get a screen asking you if you really want to spend $3.99 or whatever. Slight annoyance, but then again I have bought these before when they did something manipulative like offering 8 of the 9 available seasons of a show for "prime" viewing... Also sometimes you just want to see something now instead of waiting a year or going to a theater.
        yoz-y 7y ago
        Interesting, on my prime video page I can't buy anything. It only shows shows and movies that are included.
cortesoft 7y ago
I never understand the complaint of a small library for Netflix... there are way more things to watch than I have time for. More things are coming out than I can watch. Who are these people who watch so much stuff they run out of things to watch.
- staticassertion 7y ago
  I think watching TV has shifted to "I wonder what's on, that looks interesting I'll watch that" to "There's a million things on, but I just want to watch X, and if X is not available then there may as well be 0 things on". I used to go to Netflix for a few core shows (and still do) but they've slowly moved off. 30 Rock, Buffy, Sunny in Philly - all are gone, which means the number of shows I actually care to watch on Netflix was cut in about half. They may have a million other titles, but it's extremely rare that I'm in a "browse and pick something" mood these days. It's also why I hate the fragmentation. All 3 of those shows are from different networks - one day they will all be on their own respective subscription based websites. And I'm gonna just go back to pirating.
  - cbsks 7y ago
    > 30 Rock, Buffy, Sunny in Philly > It's also why I hate the fragmentation. All 3 of those shows are from different networks - one day they will all be on their own respective subscription based websites. All 3 of those shows are on Hulu, so you only need to sign up for one additional subscription. So far. I expect that the fragmentation will only get worse from here. I subscribe to Hulu (Always Sunny, Brooklyn 99, Bob's Burgers, Rick and Morty), Netflix (Black Mirror, Arrested Development, Bojack Horseman, Great British Baking Show), and Disney+ (The Mandalorian). I'm paying $31 a month for these subscriptions. I keep wondering if I'd be better off buying DVDs/Blu-rays and ripping them all to a plex server instead, but that seems like a lot of work, even if it would pay off in the long run.
    - staticassertion 7y ago
      'So Far' is the key. They also used to all be on Netflix. Money isn't an issue, it's mostly just annoying to have N services to juggle. Pirating's really easy - I use exactly one pirating website, and it's free. Way simpler.
subhero 7y ago
Yes, those “facades” are super useful. Problem is that most are US centric and simply break for international users, since streaming rights by country is a nightmarish jungle.
dlkf 7y ago
> 1) obfuscate its surprisingly shallow library A thousand times, this. Netflix should take all the money they are spending on ML to solve a discovery problem that they don't even have, and instead buy up rights to flicks from the period 1950-2010. A lot of these movies can't be streamed or downloaded anywhere - the only legal way to get them is to pay a grossly inflated price for the DVD on Amazon. This is actually a massive archival problem, and I would love to see someone tackle it. Unfortunately, it almost certainly won't be one of the current major streaming platforms.
- the_watcher 7y ago
  The ridiculous thing is that the DVD side of Netflix used to be an amazing source for these kinds of films
  - dleslie 7y ago
    It still is; for those in the USA only. https://dvd.netflix.com/Queue https://dvd.netflix.com/Queue
    - dlkf 7y ago
      > for those in the USA only Key distinction
- LeifCarrotson 7y ago
  Most of those rights to flicks from 1950-2010 are owned by: (1) Competitors (eg. Disney+) (2) Studios leasing the rights to competitors (eg. Amazon) (3) Studios that want to expand into the new streaming market (all the rest). The remaining few indie or abandoned flicks are not really worth it.
  - dlkf 7y ago
    To be fair, I oversimplified the problem. Every film's rights are owned by someone, and the problem wouldn't be solved entirely by Netflix merely throwing money at it. But the fact remains that there are a lot of great films from this period that as far as I can tell (and for some I've looked pretty hard) are not available for streaming on any platform - YouTube, Mubi, Netflix, Prime, iTunes, etc etc. [0] The problem is worse if A) you're not in the US and B) you are interested in stuff that wasn't a box office top 100 hit. It's an empirical question as to whether, as you say "the remaining few indie or abandoned flicks are not really worth it." Netflix has certainly decided that this is the case, but it's not obvious to me that they're right. [0] https://www.engadget.com/2018/08/10/missing-movies-not-available-for-streaming https://www.engadget.com/2018/08/10/missing-movies-not-avail...
eigenvector 7y ago
A major symptom of #1 is that there is no way to 'hide' content you're not interested in or any indication of what you've already watched. So I'm forced to endure giant, autoplaying banner ads for shows I know 100% I will never, ever watch.
- nwienert 7y ago
  Yea my 60 year old dad always complains why they can’t have a “never show me this again” because he’s tired of scrolling through all the garbage. It’s a shame there aren’t more dictatorial Jobs-esque CEOs striking out all the bullshit vanity-metric-chasing the upper/middle managers will do if you let them. The world would be a better place.
- hobofan 7y ago
  Why don't you just "dislike" such content? I understand that that's probably not how one is supposed to use such a feature, but that has been working pretty well to hide unwanted content for me.
  - bigwavedave 7y ago
    For me personally, disliking content only has the effect of graying-out the suggested material; it still stays there for eternity.
majky538 7y ago
Oh, you are quite right. I've just created Netflix account, exploring movies - series based on images - trailers when browsing with mouse and so on. Anyway, I miss basic filter.. Watched 2 seasons of 2 different series in less than 48 hours.
mindtricks 7y ago
The shallow library argument is becoming increasingly dated. If you compare it to studios who have been around for decades, then sure. If you want to limit it to "quality" content, then maybe. If you want to look at it from a pure numbers perspective, Netflix is killing it. https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/netflix-more-2019-originals-than-entire-tv-industry-in-2005-1203441709/ https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/netflix-more-2019-originals...
- StavrosK 7y ago
  Netflix is killing it if you think of them as a cable channel, like HBO. If you think of them as a movie rental shop, like Blockbuster (or Netflix) used to be, they're terrible.
- thedaemon 7y ago
  Ah yes, the flood of foreign language TV shows and movies that we have no interest in watching. The problem is, Netflix has lost all of these licensed products and are forced to created original content. The golden age of streaming is dead. We now have cable/satellite style streaming services. Instead of 1 big bundle, we now have 2-6 streaming services paying roughly the same amount. At least there are fewer commercials.
ehsankia 7y ago
While those sites are fine for searching for specific content, I'm surprised no one has made a custom netflix homepage extension (and believe me, I've looked for it many times over the years). I just want something simple and minimal. No bullshit fullscreen autoplaying trailer at the top. Just 3 sections: Shows I've been watching (with an easy button to remove any i'm done with), shows I have marked as interested in, and then at the bottom, there can be recommended shows and new content. That's it. It shouldn't be that hard. Some day I might code it myself.
thdrdt 7y ago
shallow library Is this true? Lately I stumbled upon some movies made in India. And suddenly there was a whole new catalog available. I think it just sucks to discover new content because you always get stuck in the 'more like this' search loop.

usrusr 7y ago

> 3) promote Netflix original content You have no idea how much I prefer this over the dominant competing model which is "promote content that costs extra because it is not actually included in the subscription I already pay". Netflix at least is trying to make me satisfied with the content available, instead of making me yearn for more in order to upsell.

bootloop 7y ago
There is no such thing on Netflix as there is nothing to pay extra for. They just try to avoid you canceling your subscription when their licensing agreements are not getting renewed and everything else except their original content is gone.
- jessaustin 7y ago
  This phenomenon definitely exists on competitors e.g. Prime. Lots of screen space wasted on PPV stuff...
  - yoz-y 7y ago
    Prime has PPV? It that a US thing? In France it only shows content directly available. Amazon originals are often promoted first.
    - jessaustin 7y ago
      Originals are often promoted, and maybe I'm using the wrong acronym with "PPV", but if you click on anything that doesn't have a tiny "prime" ribbon in the corner, you'll get a screen asking you if you really want to spend $3.99 or whatever. Slight annoyance, but then again I have bought these before when they did something manipulative like offering 8 of the 9 available seasons of a show for "prime" viewing... Also sometimes you just want to see something now instead of waiting a year or going to a theater.
      - yoz-y 7y ago
        Interesting, on my prime video page I can't buy anything. It only shows shows and movies that are included.

cortesoft 7y ago

I never understand the complaint of a small library for Netflix... there are way more things to watch than I have time for. More things are coming out than I can watch. Who are these people who watch so much stuff they run out of things to watch.

staticassertion 7y ago
I think watching TV has shifted to "I wonder what's on, that looks interesting I'll watch that" to "There's a million things on, but I just want to watch X, and if X is not available then there may as well be 0 things on". I used to go to Netflix for a few core shows (and still do) but they've slowly moved off. 30 Rock, Buffy, Sunny in Philly - all are gone, which means the number of shows I actually care to watch on Netflix was cut in about half. They may have a million other titles, but it's extremely rare that I'm in a "browse and pick something" mood these days. It's also why I hate the fragmentation. All 3 of those shows are from different networks - one day they will all be on their own respective subscription based websites. And I'm gonna just go back to pirating.
- cbsks 7y ago
  > 30 Rock, Buffy, Sunny in Philly > It's also why I hate the fragmentation. All 3 of those shows are from different networks - one day they will all be on their own respective subscription based websites. All 3 of those shows are on Hulu, so you only need to sign up for one additional subscription. So far. I expect that the fragmentation will only get worse from here. I subscribe to Hulu (Always Sunny, Brooklyn 99, Bob's Burgers, Rick and Morty), Netflix (Black Mirror, Arrested Development, Bojack Horseman, Great British Baking Show), and Disney+ (The Mandalorian). I'm paying $31 a month for these subscriptions. I keep wondering if I'd be better off buying DVDs/Blu-rays and ripping them all to a plex server instead, but that seems like a lot of work, even if it would pay off in the long run.
  - staticassertion 7y ago
    'So Far' is the key. They also used to all be on Netflix. Money isn't an issue, it's mostly just annoying to have N services to juggle. Pirating's really easy - I use exactly one pirating website, and it's free. Way simpler.

subhero 7y ago

Yes, those “facades” are super useful. Problem is that most are US centric and simply break for international users, since streaming rights by country is a nightmarish jungle.

dlkf 7y ago

> 1) obfuscate its surprisingly shallow library A thousand times, this. Netflix should take all the money they are spending on ML to solve a discovery problem that they don't even have, and instead buy up rights to flicks from the period 1950-2010. A lot of these movies can't be streamed or downloaded anywhere - the only legal way to get them is to pay a grossly inflated price for the DVD on Amazon. This is actually a massive archival problem, and I would love to see someone tackle it. Unfortunately, it almost certainly won't be one of the current major streaming platforms.

the_watcher 7y ago
The ridiculous thing is that the DVD side of Netflix used to be an amazing source for these kinds of films
- dleslie 7y ago
  It still is; for those in the USA only. https://dvd.netflix.com/Queue https://dvd.netflix.com/Queue
  - dlkf 7y ago
    > for those in the USA only Key distinction
LeifCarrotson 7y ago
Most of those rights to flicks from 1950-2010 are owned by: (1) Competitors (eg. Disney+) (2) Studios leasing the rights to competitors (eg. Amazon) (3) Studios that want to expand into the new streaming market (all the rest). The remaining few indie or abandoned flicks are not really worth it.
- dlkf 7y ago
  To be fair, I oversimplified the problem. Every film's rights are owned by someone, and the problem wouldn't be solved entirely by Netflix merely throwing money at it. But the fact remains that there are a lot of great films from this period that as far as I can tell (and for some I've looked pretty hard) are not available for streaming on any platform - YouTube, Mubi, Netflix, Prime, iTunes, etc etc. [0] The problem is worse if A) you're not in the US and B) you are interested in stuff that wasn't a box office top 100 hit. It's an empirical question as to whether, as you say "the remaining few indie or abandoned flicks are not really worth it." Netflix has certainly decided that this is the case, but it's not obvious to me that they're right. [0] https://www.engadget.com/2018/08/10/missing-movies-not-available-for-streaming https://www.engadget.com/2018/08/10/missing-movies-not-avail...

eigenvector 7y ago

A major symptom of #1 is that there is no way to 'hide' content you're not interested in or any indication of what you've already watched. So I'm forced to endure giant, autoplaying banner ads for shows I know 100% I will never, ever watch.

nwienert 7y ago
Yea my 60 year old dad always complains why they can’t have a “never show me this again” because he’s tired of scrolling through all the garbage. It’s a shame there aren’t more dictatorial Jobs-esque CEOs striking out all the bullshit vanity-metric-chasing the upper/middle managers will do if you let them. The world would be a better place.
hobofan 7y ago
Why don't you just "dislike" such content? I understand that that's probably not how one is supposed to use such a feature, but that has been working pretty well to hide unwanted content for me.
- bigwavedave 7y ago
  For me personally, disliking content only has the effect of graying-out the suggested material; it still stays there for eternity.

majky538 7y ago

Oh, you are quite right. I've just created Netflix account, exploring movies - series based on images - trailers when browsing with mouse and so on. Anyway, I miss basic filter.. Watched 2 seasons of 2 different series in less than 48 hours.

mindtricks 7y ago

The shallow library argument is becoming increasingly dated. If you compare it to studios who have been around for decades, then sure. If you want to limit it to "quality" content, then maybe. If you want to look at it from a pure numbers perspective, Netflix is killing it. https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/netflix-more-2019-originals-than-entire-tv-industry-in-2005-1203441709/ https://variety.com/2019/tv/news/netflix-more-2019-originals...

StavrosK 7y ago
Netflix is killing it if you think of them as a cable channel, like HBO. If you think of them as a movie rental shop, like Blockbuster (or Netflix) used to be, they're terrible.
thedaemon 7y ago
Ah yes, the flood of foreign language TV shows and movies that we have no interest in watching. The problem is, Netflix has lost all of these licensed products and are forced to created original content. The golden age of streaming is dead. We now have cable/satellite style streaming services. Instead of 1 big bundle, we now have 2-6 streaming services paying roughly the same amount. At least there are fewer commercials.

ehsankia 7y ago

While those sites are fine for searching for specific content, I'm surprised no one has made a custom netflix homepage extension (and believe me, I've looked for it many times over the years). I just want something simple and minimal. No bullshit fullscreen autoplaying trailer at the top. Just 3 sections: Shows I've been watching (with an easy button to remove any i'm done with), shows I have marked as interested in, and then at the bottom, there can be recommended shows and new content. That's it. It shouldn't be that hard. Some day I might code it myself.

thdrdt 7y ago

shallow library Is this true? Lately I stumbled upon some movies made in India. And suddenly there was a whole new catalog available. I think it just sucks to discover new content because you always get stuck in the 'more like this' search loop.