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What I don't understand is: why don't they go to a university in Europe? I just checked for my alma mater: tuition fee is ~500 euro for 1 year. You pay about 4k

What I don't understand is: why don't they go to a university in Europe? I just checked for my alma mater: tuition fee is ~500 euro for 1 year. You pay about 4k in rent per year (this is probably too high an estimate). The level of education is high, and the programs are available in English.

ameister14 7y ago
Tuition for EU residents is usually not the same as tuition for American students. It's still cheaper than school in the US, but not by nearly as much
- DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
  University in Germany is just as cheap for foreigners as it is for Germans. It's only a few hundred Euros per semester, and comes with benefits like cheap public transportation and subsidized meals.
- toolslive 7y ago
  Here's the tuition fee table for KULeuven. https://www.kuleuven.be/inschrijvingen/registration/fees https://www.kuleuven.be/inschrijvingen/registration/fees This university is located in Belgium (where people speak Dutch, English and French), and ranks quite well. https://nieuws.kuleuven.be/en/content/2019/ku-leuven-rises-three-places-in-top-50-of-world-university-rankings-2020 https://nieuws.kuleuven.be/en/content/2019/ku-leuven-rises-t... Travel time from NY is about 7h. Sure, you might be in for a culture shock, but someone coming from Alabama will have a shock going to MIT or Caltech too.
xwdv 7y ago
Because most European universities are crap compared to American ones. Crude, but the truth.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- llampx 7y ago
  Strong words. What do you learn in American university that you don't learn in, say, a German one? I know I could have done without two years of basic education in the form of GenEds.
  - refurb 7y ago
    You have to understand the American mentality. I’ve talked with parents who told me how unfortunate that their kid can’t go to a good school. The school has a score of 9.2/10 versus the school they wanted which scores 9.5/10.
    - thatfrenchguy 7y ago
      We can all thank Greatschools and their Gates foundation grants for making everyone think you can assign a number to the quality of a school (which most people in the rest of the world would think is nonsense), and to perpetuate redlining by making sure your kids go to school only with other wasian people.
      - dragonwriter 7y ago
        The policy push toward simple reduced-to-a-number school report cards significantly predates Greatschools, which just jumped on the bandwagon.
- x3ro 7y ago
  Do you have any evidence to back up this rather broad claim?
- esotericn 7y ago
  Ever heard of a little kernel known as Linux?
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
- dragonwriter 7y ago
  > Because most European universities are crap compared to American ones. That's probably true if you compare the average European university to the handful of elite American one's, but it's even more true when you compare the average American University to those same elites (even if you exclude all the unaccredited and for-profit schools, which really drag the American quality standards down.)
peruvian 7y ago
Not everyone wants to go live in another continent at 18, an expensive flight away, with no family or friends, different culture and perhaps different language? Plenty of reasons.
crmrc114 7y ago
This is why many doctors in the US get their basic medical schooling outside of the US. (Often in the Caribbean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_medical_schools_in_the_Caribbean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_medical_schools_in_the... )
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- throwaway5752 7y ago
  That generally is not why US born doctors go to medical school outside of the US.
  - BeetleB 7y ago
    > That generally is not why US born doctors go to medical school outside of the US. Everyone I know who did it did so for two reasons, and this is one of them. Getting into medical school means tonnes of debt - similar to art school, perhaps. And if you don't do well enough at your residency, or at your medical school prior to that, you are completely screwed in a way those who went to art school are. Going to the Caribbean (or any other country) for medical school has its risks, though. You are treated differently when applying for residency programs, and need a much much higher score on the USMLE than someone trained in the US to match. But if you don't, you're not stuck with crippling debt. Oh, and the other reason? Quicker to graduate. Most countries allow you to enter medical school right after high school.
- seattle_spring 7y ago
  Caribbean schools are even more expensive than US med schools. A contact of mine is graduating from Ross University with $550k of debt. Students go there because their bar for incoming students is lower, and not at all because they're cheaper.
  - russdill 7y ago
    It's the same with veterinarians as well.
cafard 7y ago
A neighbor's kid is at St. Andrew's in Scotland. But I don't know of many who have chosen that route.
helen___keller 7y ago
They don't market nearly as effectively. They don't appear on rankings for top colleges. They don't send leaflets and no one you know goes there. The only European Uni I knew was oxford, and I had no idea that I could save money on a similar education in Europe. In the first place I just assumed I would need to know a foreign language for any non-UK European school.
- HarryHirsch 7y ago
  They don't market nearly as effectively Heh, yes. A long time ago there was this guide aimed at foreign students coming to study in the US. They had a warning: if the school pitches itself at foreigners it does not have sufficient domestic students. The prospective customer should ponder long and hard about the motive of the place. (The motive may not always be nefarious. Back then, the Classics departments of Oxford and Cambridge did pitch themselves at German school leavers because in England Latin instruction was plainly worthless. In Germany it was actually at an adequate level.)
- throwaway72873 7y ago
  Why they would market it? Education is subsided by government. Hope is that student will stay after finishing Uni. Mostly it targets students from poorer countries, for example Polish universities are attracting people from former soviet union. Some ignorant american would just drink, cost money and move away at end.
  - helen___keller 7y ago
    > Why they would market it? They wouldn't, but American universities do and it works. Thus the answer to GPs conundrum of why don't more students consider school in Europe.
- bonoboTP 7y ago
  > They don't market nearly as effectively It's not in the interest of any European government or university to get flooded by American (or any other foreign, non-EU) students. The only reason some German states haven't introduced a fee for non-EU residents yet is probably that their number is not that high yet. But some other German states have already set up such extra fees. Some other countries place fees on English-language programmes, while those in the local language remain free.
ArmandGrillet 7y ago
List of probable truths when studying in Europe as an American at 18: - You've never left home for more than a month. - There will be few (if any) Americans in a European bachelor's program. - There is a 6 to 9 hours timezone difference with home. - You don't have an easy time getting information compared to with American universities. - The country will not speak English (UK aside). I know they speak english in French and German unis but your landlord probably won't, nor your health insurer. That's a massive list of stress-inducing elements you have to take into account. For a master/PhD the situation is totally different but it's still not that easy (source: did an international master programme).
- thatfrenchguy 7y ago
  > I know they speak english in French and German unis Lol in France, except in some top programs, they usually won't usefully speak English. Your landlord may be better at it.
- dbspin 7y ago
  Ireland is also a solution, with several excellent universities.
  - barry-cotter 7y ago
    Only Trinity and University College Dublin are in or near the global top 200. Two is not several.
tyoma 7y ago
Is that tuition for foreign students too? Some countries offer international students a subsidized rate (Germany comes to mind) but others do not.

ameister14 7y ago

Tuition for EU residents is usually not the same as tuition for American students. It's still cheaper than school in the US, but not by nearly as much

DiogenesKynikos 7y ago
University in Germany is just as cheap for foreigners as it is for Germans. It's only a few hundred Euros per semester, and comes with benefits like cheap public transportation and subsidized meals.
toolslive 7y ago
Here's the tuition fee table for KULeuven. https://www.kuleuven.be/inschrijvingen/registration/fees https://www.kuleuven.be/inschrijvingen/registration/fees This university is located in Belgium (where people speak Dutch, English and French), and ranks quite well. https://nieuws.kuleuven.be/en/content/2019/ku-leuven-rises-three-places-in-top-50-of-world-university-rankings-2020 https://nieuws.kuleuven.be/en/content/2019/ku-leuven-rises-t... Travel time from NY is about 7h. Sure, you might be in for a culture shock, but someone coming from Alabama will have a shock going to MIT or Caltech too.

xwdv 7y ago

Because most European universities are crap compared to American ones. Crude, but the truth.

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
llampx 7y ago
Strong words. What do you learn in American university that you don't learn in, say, a German one? I know I could have done without two years of basic education in the form of GenEds.
- refurb 7y ago
  You have to understand the American mentality. I’ve talked with parents who told me how unfortunate that their kid can’t go to a good school. The school has a score of 9.2/10 versus the school they wanted which scores 9.5/10.
  - thatfrenchguy 7y ago
    We can all thank Greatschools and their Gates foundation grants for making everyone think you can assign a number to the quality of a school (which most people in the rest of the world would think is nonsense), and to perpetuate redlining by making sure your kids go to school only with other wasian people.
    - dragonwriter 7y ago
      The policy push toward simple reduced-to-a-number school report cards significantly predates Greatschools, which just jumped on the bandwagon.
x3ro 7y ago
Do you have any evidence to back up this rather broad claim?
esotericn 7y ago
Ever heard of a little kernel known as Linux?
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
dragonwriter 7y ago
> Because most European universities are crap compared to American ones. That's probably true if you compare the average European university to the handful of elite American one's, but it's even more true when you compare the average American University to those same elites (even if you exclude all the unaccredited and for-profit schools, which really drag the American quality standards down.)

peruvian 7y ago

Not everyone wants to go live in another continent at 18, an expensive flight away, with no family or friends, different culture and perhaps different language? Plenty of reasons.

crmrc114 7y ago

This is why many doctors in the US get their basic medical schooling outside of the US. (Often in the Caribbean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_medical_schools_in_the_Caribbean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_medical_schools_in_the... )

deleted 7y ago
[deleted]
throwaway5752 7y ago
That generally is not why US born doctors go to medical school outside of the US.
- BeetleB 7y ago
  > That generally is not why US born doctors go to medical school outside of the US. Everyone I know who did it did so for two reasons, and this is one of them. Getting into medical school means tonnes of debt - similar to art school, perhaps. And if you don't do well enough at your residency, or at your medical school prior to that, you are completely screwed in a way those who went to art school are. Going to the Caribbean (or any other country) for medical school has its risks, though. You are treated differently when applying for residency programs, and need a much much higher score on the USMLE than someone trained in the US to match. But if you don't, you're not stuck with crippling debt. Oh, and the other reason? Quicker to graduate. Most countries allow you to enter medical school right after high school.
seattle_spring 7y ago
Caribbean schools are even more expensive than US med schools. A contact of mine is graduating from Ross University with $550k of debt. Students go there because their bar for incoming students is lower, and not at all because they're cheaper.
- russdill 7y ago
  It's the same with veterinarians as well.

cafard 7y ago

A neighbor's kid is at St. Andrew's in Scotland. But I don't know of many who have chosen that route.

helen___keller 7y ago

They don't market nearly as effectively. They don't appear on rankings for top colleges. They don't send leaflets and no one you know goes there. The only European Uni I knew was oxford, and I had no idea that I could save money on a similar education in Europe. In the first place I just assumed I would need to know a foreign language for any non-UK European school.

HarryHirsch 7y ago
They don't market nearly as effectively Heh, yes. A long time ago there was this guide aimed at foreign students coming to study in the US. They had a warning: if the school pitches itself at foreigners it does not have sufficient domestic students. The prospective customer should ponder long and hard about the motive of the place. (The motive may not always be nefarious. Back then, the Classics departments of Oxford and Cambridge did pitch themselves at German school leavers because in England Latin instruction was plainly worthless. In Germany it was actually at an adequate level.)
throwaway72873 7y ago
Why they would market it? Education is subsided by government. Hope is that student will stay after finishing Uni. Mostly it targets students from poorer countries, for example Polish universities are attracting people from former soviet union. Some ignorant american would just drink, cost money and move away at end.
- helen___keller 7y ago
  > Why they would market it? They wouldn't, but American universities do and it works. Thus the answer to GPs conundrum of why don't more students consider school in Europe.
bonoboTP 7y ago
> They don't market nearly as effectively It's not in the interest of any European government or university to get flooded by American (or any other foreign, non-EU) students. The only reason some German states haven't introduced a fee for non-EU residents yet is probably that their number is not that high yet. But some other German states have already set up such extra fees. Some other countries place fees on English-language programmes, while those in the local language remain free.

ArmandGrillet 7y ago

List of probable truths when studying in Europe as an American at 18: - You've never left home for more than a month. - There will be few (if any) Americans in a European bachelor's program. - There is a 6 to 9 hours timezone difference with home. - You don't have an easy time getting information compared to with American universities. - The country will not speak English (UK aside). I know they speak english in French and German unis but your landlord probably won't, nor your health insurer. That's a massive list of stress-inducing elements you have to take into account. For a master/PhD the situation is totally different but it's still not that easy (source: did an international master programme).

thatfrenchguy 7y ago
> I know they speak english in French and German unis Lol in France, except in some top programs, they usually won't usefully speak English. Your landlord may be better at it.
dbspin 7y ago
Ireland is also a solution, with several excellent universities.
- barry-cotter 7y ago
  Only Trinity and University College Dublin are in or near the global top 200. Two is not several.

tyoma 7y ago

Is that tuition for foreign students too? Some countries offer international students a subsidized rate (Germany comes to mind) but others do not.