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> a desire to honestly explore the pros and cons of that surgery What if these pros and cons were subjective, and someone decided that in the end, the cons out

> a desire to honestly explore the pros and cons of that surgery What if these pros and cons were subjective, and someone decided that in the end, the cons outweighed the pros? Would you cast them as an evil person and exile them from your safe space? Would you accept their opinion, respectfully disagree, and move on? It seems that you must either abide by the ideology, censor yourself, or be exiled and called a nazi. This goes against everything that a university is about: free speech and open discussion. > cisgender people who have little knowledge of the emotional land mines they can trigger by simply relying on the "common sense" they have learned over a lifetime. Correct. Cisgendered people represent the majority of the population. Personally I have had maybe one or two opportunities to interact with a transgender person because they make up a tiny percentage of the population. That is not to say that I refuse to be respectful towards them, it shows that the majority of people don't get the chance to interact and learn what to avoid saying. Is everyone really required to learn all these new words / triggers / etc. in order to appease a tiny tiny fraction of the population? Genuinely curious to know your thoughts.

danharaj 7y ago
> Is everyone really required to learn all these new words / triggers / etc. in order to appease a tiny tiny fraction of the population? Every person you meet is a minority of 1 in 7 billion. Is it so hard for you to learn how to understand people? Do you have trouble with new words and concepts?
- dctoedt 7y ago
  > Do you have trouble with new words and concepts? The trouble comes when a tiny minority (i) decides that the accepted meaning of common terms no longer suits their personal preference — I refer here to the use of they as a generic singular pronoun in formal language — and (ii) insists loudly that anyone who fails to conform to their new preference is being hurtful and disrespectful instead of merely precise.
  - danharaj 7y ago
    Can you use a concrete example to illustrate your claim?
    - dctoedt 7y ago
      I did in the edited version (I hadn't seen your question before doing the edit).
      - danharaj 7y ago
        I'ma be real with you chief. That's hella shallow and pedantic. I think it would be hurtful and disrespectful to die on such a mole hill instead of just accommodating people over something so simple.
        dctoedt 7y ago
        It never ceases to astonish me how ready some people are to feel hurt and disrespected — and to brand anyone who disagrees with them as "shallow and pedantic." I have no desire to expend scarce brain cycles trying to keep up with who wants to be addressed in what manner.
        danharaj 7y ago
        > I have no desire to expend scarce brain cycles trying to keep up with who wants to be addressed in what manner. This is disrespectful. You might think that this disrespect is warranted- that's fine; one must make judgment calls about what to respect and what not to respect. It's still disrespect. Be yourself: own it :)
        dctoedt 7y ago
        > This is disrespectful. You've calibrated your disrespect alarm to an awfully low setpoint.
        7y ago
- diag 7y ago
  All you have to do if you say something offensive to somebody is say "I'm sorry, I won't say that again. I'll be more accommodating in the future."
SolaceQuantum 7y ago
"Personally I have had maybe one or two opportunities to interact with a transgender person because they make up a tiny percentage of the population." That's super interesting to me, because in my experience in any social group I participate in greater than, say, 50 or 100(anything from gamer rooms to code-a-thons), chances are good that at least one person will not be cis. I may not know they aren't cis, but in spaces that ask for preferred pronouns, it's quite common for they/them to be taken up as an accepted pronoun.
shkkmo 7y ago
> What if these pros and cons were subjective, and someone decided that in the end, the cons outweighed the pros? Of course the pros and cons can be subjective, relative and individual. Among the trans and non-binary community, sexual reassignment surgery is not ubiquitous. > Would you cast them as an evil person and exile them from your safe space? Would you accept their opinion, respectfully disagree, and move on? You seem to be missing the distinction between sharing your opinions kindly and respectfully and self-censoring. My point is that people without much experience on this topic will likely have no clue about they ways they are being cruel, disrespectful or ignorant. > Is everyone really required to learn all these new words / triggers / etc. in order to appease a tiny tiny fraction of the population? Genuinely curious to know your thoughts. If you would like to act respectful towards (and be taken seriously by) any population, you must make an effort to learn their volcabulary and desired forms of respectful communication. This applies to any cultural group and isn't anything new or an audacious request.

danharaj 7y ago

> Is everyone really required to learn all these new words / triggers / etc. in order to appease a tiny tiny fraction of the population? Every person you meet is a minority of 1 in 7 billion. Is it so hard for you to learn how to understand people? Do you have trouble with new words and concepts?

dctoedt 7y ago
> Do you have trouble with new words and concepts? The trouble comes when a tiny minority (i) decides that the accepted meaning of common terms no longer suits their personal preference — I refer here to the use of they as a generic singular pronoun in formal language — and (ii) insists loudly that anyone who fails to conform to their new preference is being hurtful and disrespectful instead of merely precise.
- danharaj 7y ago
  Can you use a concrete example to illustrate your claim?
  - dctoedt 7y ago
    I did in the edited version (I hadn't seen your question before doing the edit).
    - danharaj 7y ago
      I'ma be real with you chief. That's hella shallow and pedantic. I think it would be hurtful and disrespectful to die on such a mole hill instead of just accommodating people over something so simple.
      - dctoedt 7y ago
        It never ceases to astonish me how ready some people are to feel hurt and disrespected — and to brand anyone who disagrees with them as "shallow and pedantic." I have no desire to expend scarce brain cycles trying to keep up with who wants to be addressed in what manner.
        danharaj 7y ago
        > I have no desire to expend scarce brain cycles trying to keep up with who wants to be addressed in what manner. This is disrespectful. You might think that this disrespect is warranted- that's fine; one must make judgment calls about what to respect and what not to respect. It's still disrespect. Be yourself: own it :)
        dctoedt 7y ago
        > This is disrespectful. You've calibrated your disrespect alarm to an awfully low setpoint.
        7y ago
diag 7y ago
All you have to do if you say something offensive to somebody is say "I'm sorry, I won't say that again. I'll be more accommodating in the future."

SolaceQuantum 7y ago

"Personally I have had maybe one or two opportunities to interact with a transgender person because they make up a tiny percentage of the population." That's super interesting to me, because in my experience in any social group I participate in greater than, say, 50 or 100(anything from gamer rooms to code-a-thons), chances are good that at least one person will not be cis. I may not know they aren't cis, but in spaces that ask for preferred pronouns, it's quite common for they/them to be taken up as an accepted pronoun.

shkkmo 7y ago

> What if these pros and cons were subjective, and someone decided that in the end, the cons outweighed the pros? Of course the pros and cons can be subjective, relative and individual. Among the trans and non-binary community, sexual reassignment surgery is not ubiquitous. > Would you cast them as an evil person and exile them from your safe space? Would you accept their opinion, respectfully disagree, and move on? You seem to be missing the distinction between sharing your opinions kindly and respectfully and self-censoring. My point is that people without much experience on this topic will likely have no clue about they ways they are being cruel, disrespectful or ignorant. > Is everyone really required to learn all these new words / triggers / etc. in order to appease a tiny tiny fraction of the population? Genuinely curious to know your thoughts. If you would like to act respectful towards (and be taken seriously by) any population, you must make an effort to learn their volcabulary and desired forms of respectful communication. This applies to any cultural group and isn't anything new or an audacious request.