4 ms·

I am actually surprised that PG doesn't feel uncomfortable about the 'acclaim' that he is getting for writing many of the things he has said that are not relate

by gist 7y ago

I am actually surprised that PG doesn't feel uncomfortable about the 'acclaim' that he is getting for writing many of the things he has said that are not related to anything he has expertise in. Reminds me of celebrities who opine about politics with their thoughts (sometimes not always with PG). Paul is authoritative on many topics. General thoughts about life and people are great to hear what he thinks. Why not? But he is no more special than 100000 other people who have no audience. Does he know this? I've often thought he should do some A/B posting with his thoughts. Write something and then randomly decide whether to put it on his blog or some other place and see what the interest level is.

dang 7y ago
They're essays. The word means 'attempt' and the genre has always been about non-expertise. Montaigne was the ultimate non-expert.
- gist 7y ago
  My thought is that Paul should view his essays at least as seriously as someone who is writing an important college application essay given who the audience is (college admissions in that case; HN readers in this case among others). Or maybe someone writing an opinion piece for a newspaper that is widely read and taken as significant. Imagine as an extreme (and not what PG is doing) if someone writing an 'essay' were to express objectionable stereotypes about people (women, minorities, certain women). [1] The point is if you have a following I think you need to take what you write (essay or not) more seriously. After all PG for whatever reason with his essays typically has several people review before posting which appears to not be consistent in a small way with the fact that an essay (by what you are saying) is about non-expertise. If that is the case why do you need others expertise to vet it before posting? [1] If it's someone's point of view why does it bother people so much when it's expressed if they are stating it as their impression and not fact?
  - dang 7y ago
    If anyone is taking pg's essays as what they they ought to think rather than as what he happens to think, that's their problem, not pg's. I don't think anybody is taking them that way, though; people are just conjuring this up for some strange reason. Some even suggested that HN has this response! Actually, I think I know the reason. pg writes to maximize brevity and directness. He's always interested in the shortest logical path from A to B. When language is optimized that way, it has a force that can sound like an implicit claim to authority. So his essays land that way with some readers, and then they react with a sort of protest: who is this guy and why does he get to act like an authority? But he isn't—what he's doing is stripping out everything extraneous, and that includes the soft touches that normally soothe the reader—"this is what I think", "your mileage may vary", that kind of thing. He's not stripping them out because he wants to provoke or thinks he's an expert or anything like that. Rather, it's a matter of taste. He likes to make things minimal. The same impulse is behind Bel, or the design of HN's front page. This is someone who might spend weeks getting rid of a single line of code if he was convinced the program could be shorter. Before I met pg I thought it was impossible for someone to talk the way that he writes. But he does. He's always going for the shortest way to put things. What's clearer in spoken language than in writing is why he does this. It's for pleasure. In person it's infectious, because he clearly does it for its own sake and for fun. It's also essentially the thought process of an essayist: someone on the hunt for just the turn of phrase that makes a point in just the right way, and then moves on. > If that is the case why do you need others expertise to vet it before posting? They might think of something you missed or find parts that are unclear. But I don't think he's looking for experts so much as good readers.
    - juped 7y ago
      Anyone can be direct. Fewer can be direct while having a lot of money. I'd bet the latter is on more people's minds.
      - dang 7y ago
        That's probably a huge and mostly hidden factor. Another is the ambivalent reactions people have to influential personalities, which pg has been in this community.
- FreakLegion 7y ago
  > The word means 'attempt' It can, but doesn't in this context. 'Essay' was a sort-of polyseme (like 'passion', which can still mean 'suffering') that has long since severed ties with its origin. Outside certain narrow academic discussions, the etymology and current use of 'essay' have effectively nothing to do with one another. In any case though pg does pretend to some amount of expertise. "How to Do Philosophy" is an example.
  - dang 7y ago
    Of course it does; it has kept a close association with this meaning throughout literary history. An essay is an attempt, a sketch, thinking out loud. It's the literary genre equivalent of informal conversation. In an essay, you discover what you think by writing it, just as in exploratory programming you discover what your program is by programming it. To say that essays aren't for non-authoritative musing is like saying novels aren't for depicting human experience.
    - tyre 7y ago
      I strongly disagree with this. The greatest essayists are not putting a "sketch" into the world. I cannot imagine reading an Isaiah Berlin essay and saying, "this is just informal conversation." Consider Didion, Foster Wallace, Sontag, Mailer, Orwell, Hitchens, Paine, Zadie Smith, the founding fathers of the United States via the Federalist Papers. There is no lack in seriousness, no lack in rigor, and no lack direct purpose backed by thoughtful consideration and ample evidence. There are _also_ informal or unserious or musing essays, but please do not lump together the entire genre of essays with a description of Medium posts.
      - dang 7y ago
        I think we got some signals crossed. I wasn't talking about being unserious—just that you don't have to be an expert to write a fine essay. I haven't read all the authors you list, but the ones I have support the point. They were not specialists writing about topics they were authorities on. They were good writers and thinkers exploring the topics they were writing about.
- sillysaurusx 7y ago
  For what it’s worth, I explained the situation to a friend, and they read the essay and said it was their favorite. They said most of pg’s essays feel exhausting, and they don’t generally like reading them. So I guess I was mistaken, since the audience is the ultimate test of an essay. It just felt painful to see so much left unsaid. But my friend said that it was immediately injected into the reader’s mind, and didn’t need to be said.

by gist 7y ago

dang 7y ago

They're essays. The word means 'attempt' and the genre has always been about non-expertise. Montaigne was the ultimate non-expert.

gist 7y ago
My thought is that Paul should view his essays at least as seriously as someone who is writing an important college application essay given who the audience is (college admissions in that case; HN readers in this case among others). Or maybe someone writing an opinion piece for a newspaper that is widely read and taken as significant. Imagine as an extreme (and not what PG is doing) if someone writing an 'essay' were to express objectionable stereotypes about people (women, minorities, certain women). [1] The point is if you have a following I think you need to take what you write (essay or not) more seriously. After all PG for whatever reason with his essays typically has several people review before posting which appears to not be consistent in a small way with the fact that an essay (by what you are saying) is about non-expertise. If that is the case why do you need others expertise to vet it before posting? [1] If it's someone's point of view why does it bother people so much when it's expressed if they are stating it as their impression and not fact?
- dang 7y ago
  If anyone is taking pg's essays as what they they ought to think rather than as what he happens to think, that's their problem, not pg's. I don't think anybody is taking them that way, though; people are just conjuring this up for some strange reason. Some even suggested that HN has this response! Actually, I think I know the reason. pg writes to maximize brevity and directness. He's always interested in the shortest logical path from A to B. When language is optimized that way, it has a force that can sound like an implicit claim to authority. So his essays land that way with some readers, and then they react with a sort of protest: who is this guy and why does he get to act like an authority? But he isn't—what he's doing is stripping out everything extraneous, and that includes the soft touches that normally soothe the reader—"this is what I think", "your mileage may vary", that kind of thing. He's not stripping them out because he wants to provoke or thinks he's an expert or anything like that. Rather, it's a matter of taste. He likes to make things minimal. The same impulse is behind Bel, or the design of HN's front page. This is someone who might spend weeks getting rid of a single line of code if he was convinced the program could be shorter. Before I met pg I thought it was impossible for someone to talk the way that he writes. But he does. He's always going for the shortest way to put things. What's clearer in spoken language than in writing is why he does this. It's for pleasure. In person it's infectious, because he clearly does it for its own sake and for fun. It's also essentially the thought process of an essayist: someone on the hunt for just the turn of phrase that makes a point in just the right way, and then moves on. > If that is the case why do you need others expertise to vet it before posting? They might think of something you missed or find parts that are unclear. But I don't think he's looking for experts so much as good readers.
  - juped 7y ago
    Anyone can be direct. Fewer can be direct while having a lot of money. I'd bet the latter is on more people's minds.
    - dang 7y ago
      That's probably a huge and mostly hidden factor. Another is the ambivalent reactions people have to influential personalities, which pg has been in this community.
FreakLegion 7y ago
> The word means 'attempt' It can, but doesn't in this context. 'Essay' was a sort-of polyseme (like 'passion', which can still mean 'suffering') that has long since severed ties with its origin. Outside certain narrow academic discussions, the etymology and current use of 'essay' have effectively nothing to do with one another. In any case though pg does pretend to some amount of expertise. "How to Do Philosophy" is an example.
- dang 7y ago
  Of course it does; it has kept a close association with this meaning throughout literary history. An essay is an attempt, a sketch, thinking out loud. It's the literary genre equivalent of informal conversation. In an essay, you discover what you think by writing it, just as in exploratory programming you discover what your program is by programming it. To say that essays aren't for non-authoritative musing is like saying novels aren't for depicting human experience.
  - tyre 7y ago
    I strongly disagree with this. The greatest essayists are not putting a "sketch" into the world. I cannot imagine reading an Isaiah Berlin essay and saying, "this is just informal conversation." Consider Didion, Foster Wallace, Sontag, Mailer, Orwell, Hitchens, Paine, Zadie Smith, the founding fathers of the United States via the Federalist Papers. There is no lack in seriousness, no lack in rigor, and no lack direct purpose backed by thoughtful consideration and ample evidence. There are _also_ informal or unserious or musing essays, but please do not lump together the entire genre of essays with a description of Medium posts.
    - dang 7y ago
      I think we got some signals crossed. I wasn't talking about being unserious—just that you don't have to be an expert to write a fine essay. I haven't read all the authors you list, but the ones I have support the point. They were not specialists writing about topics they were authorities on. They were good writers and thinkers exploring the topics they were writing about.
sillysaurusx 7y ago
For what it’s worth, I explained the situation to a friend, and they read the essay and said it was their favorite. They said most of pg’s essays feel exhausting, and they don’t generally like reading them. So I guess I was mistaken, since the audience is the ultimate test of an essay. It just felt painful to see so much left unsaid. But my friend said that it was immediately injected into the reader’s mind, and didn’t need to be said.