4 ms·

My grandma owns a tax consulting business and began using computers in the age of Dos. Over the years I would end up with her old computers and that's essential

by dgzl 7y ago

My grandma owns a tax consulting business and began using computers in the age of Dos. Over the years I would end up with her old computers and that's essentially how I became familiar with them when I was young. About the time I graduated with my CS degree, I realized something.... My grandma isn't actually that capable with computers. Even though she's literally been using them longer than I have, she had only really been performing a few tasks beyond get work, and never really spent time using or learning the nuances of computers and operating systems. I think she never really caught on to the changes Windows and web browsers made over the years, and she just stuck to her work. Now, you might not tell her apart from someone who just started learning.

jes5199 7y ago
that feels, to me, like a real failure of our field. What other tool can you use every day for 30 years and still be a novice at?
- confidantlake 7y ago
  Most of them. I use a toilet every day and have no idea how it works except for I push the button and my shit goes away.
  - noman-land 7y ago
    To be fair, the toilet hasn't changed much in the last 30 years but computing has drastically changed.
    - PudgePacket 7y ago
      Has it though? The development of smart phones is probably the biggest thing. Computer use is still mostly the same outside of hardware changes and the software industry. Consumer computer use is pretty stagnant I'd say. Click the icon of the program you want on the desktop. Read/watch some things, click some things, scroll a bit.
      - Cougher 7y ago
        Yes, it has. I've had many experiences that have required me to perform online sleuthing over the years just to keep my computer working properly. New programs ("apps") that seem to be change for change's sake, or worse, to try to make computers work like cell phones. My latest peeve: a Windows 10 update has caused my laptop to stop recognizing DVDs (though it plays CDs fine) and MS seems entirely disinterested in correcting the problem.
    - Wistar 7y ago
      I think toilets have changed a lot. I have a Toto toilet that uses something like .7 gallons a flush and I am fairly sure is easily capable of flushing a cat or, at least, a large russet potato. 30 years ago a toilet needed 5 gallons and would clog if you used more than 12 inches of toilet paper.
      - speedplane 7y ago
        > I have a Toto toilet that uses something like .7 gallons a flush and I am fairly sure is easily capable of flushing a cat I think you owe it to this forum to provide a citation.
        Wistar 7y ago
        Fair call and I was wrong. I have two, one is the Toto Drake II and uses 1.28 gallons per flush. The other is an Aquia IV dual flush which uses either 0.8 gals or 1.0 gals per flush. https://www.totousa.com/aquia-iv-1g-toilet-10-08-gpf https://www.totousa.com/aquia-iv-1g-toilet-10-08-gpf
        speedplane 7y ago
        I was more interested in the cat claim.
        Wistar 7y ago
        That's just a guess. I don't have a cat to test it with and I like my russet potatoes too much to try and flush one.
      - stevenicr 7y ago
        While they may have changed in many ways - as far as the UX for the average user, it's been a lever to press to make it flush. Now I still see new low flow ones that have levers, and some new ones have 2 buttons. Of course there are those that auto-sense arrive/leave in some commercial establishments... But to the average user they have no changed that much I think - most still have a lever, if you can't find it and you are looking in that general area you will see the two buttons and likely press one to see if it flushes.. and press it again if it doesn't flush enough.. just like the old ones :)
- cco 7y ago
  Cars are the first thing that springs to mind, people use them for decades and can be very inept at operating them or understanding how they work.
mihaaly 7y ago
Sounds like she has the focus on the task at hand and not the tool.
stubish 7y ago
'Not good with computers' is not a function of age. There is also an assumption that people who grew up with smart phones are 'good with computers', but often it is pretty much the same thing: rote learning, fumbling around, getting friends to show them and sticking with the familiar. Tools, and maybe the applications are toys. Where as 'good with computers' tend to view the computer itself as the toy (and what are toys? Learning devices)
- masswerk 7y ago
  In a more strict sense being "good with computers" involves programming the machine, which requires a certain type of access to the machine and its resources. Provided, we're not dealing with bare metal, this means access and intimacy with a certain operating environment – which may be subject to change, as preferences for languages change, as do operating systems or the underlying hardware. In a broader sense, being "good with computers" may mean a certain familiarity with a certain type of paradigm of interaction, as embodied in a certain suite of applications, which may and will be subject to change, as well. So nobody is "good with computers" per se.

by dgzl 7y ago

jes5199 7y ago

that feels, to me, like a real failure of our field. What other tool can you use every day for 30 years and still be a novice at?

confidantlake 7y ago
Most of them. I use a toilet every day and have no idea how it works except for I push the button and my shit goes away.
- noman-land 7y ago
  To be fair, the toilet hasn't changed much in the last 30 years but computing has drastically changed.
  - PudgePacket 7y ago
    Has it though? The development of smart phones is probably the biggest thing. Computer use is still mostly the same outside of hardware changes and the software industry. Consumer computer use is pretty stagnant I'd say. Click the icon of the program you want on the desktop. Read/watch some things, click some things, scroll a bit.
    - Cougher 7y ago
      Yes, it has. I've had many experiences that have required me to perform online sleuthing over the years just to keep my computer working properly. New programs ("apps") that seem to be change for change's sake, or worse, to try to make computers work like cell phones. My latest peeve: a Windows 10 update has caused my laptop to stop recognizing DVDs (though it plays CDs fine) and MS seems entirely disinterested in correcting the problem.
  - Wistar 7y ago
    I think toilets have changed a lot. I have a Toto toilet that uses something like .7 gallons a flush and I am fairly sure is easily capable of flushing a cat or, at least, a large russet potato. 30 years ago a toilet needed 5 gallons and would clog if you used more than 12 inches of toilet paper.
    - speedplane 7y ago
      > I have a Toto toilet that uses something like .7 gallons a flush and I am fairly sure is easily capable of flushing a cat I think you owe it to this forum to provide a citation.
      - Wistar 7y ago
        Fair call and I was wrong. I have two, one is the Toto Drake II and uses 1.28 gallons per flush. The other is an Aquia IV dual flush which uses either 0.8 gals or 1.0 gals per flush. https://www.totousa.com/aquia-iv-1g-toilet-10-08-gpf https://www.totousa.com/aquia-iv-1g-toilet-10-08-gpf
        speedplane 7y ago
        I was more interested in the cat claim.
        Wistar 7y ago
        That's just a guess. I don't have a cat to test it with and I like my russet potatoes too much to try and flush one.
    - stevenicr 7y ago
      While they may have changed in many ways - as far as the UX for the average user, it's been a lever to press to make it flush. Now I still see new low flow ones that have levers, and some new ones have 2 buttons. Of course there are those that auto-sense arrive/leave in some commercial establishments... But to the average user they have no changed that much I think - most still have a lever, if you can't find it and you are looking in that general area you will see the two buttons and likely press one to see if it flushes.. and press it again if it doesn't flush enough.. just like the old ones :)
cco 7y ago
Cars are the first thing that springs to mind, people use them for decades and can be very inept at operating them or understanding how they work.

mihaaly 7y ago

Sounds like she has the focus on the task at hand and not the tool.

stubish 7y ago

'Not good with computers' is not a function of age. There is also an assumption that people who grew up with smart phones are 'good with computers', but often it is pretty much the same thing: rote learning, fumbling around, getting friends to show them and sticking with the familiar. Tools, and maybe the applications are toys. Where as 'good with computers' tend to view the computer itself as the toy (and what are toys? Learning devices)

masswerk 7y ago
In a more strict sense being "good with computers" involves programming the machine, which requires a certain type of access to the machine and its resources. Provided, we're not dealing with bare metal, this means access and intimacy with a certain operating environment – which may be subject to change, as preferences for languages change, as do operating systems or the underlying hardware. In a broader sense, being "good with computers" may mean a certain familiarity with a certain type of paradigm of interaction, as embodied in a certain suite of applications, which may and will be subject to change, as well. So nobody is "good with computers" per se.