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A Lonely Plea: ‘Anybody Need a Grandma for Christmas?’

• Waterluvian 7y ago
  I've tried to be open and generous to others during the holidays and it almost always results in serious awkwardness. There's a matchmaking problem here. I wish I could magically know who in the neighbourhood I could just knock on the door of and say hi and invite them to the extra seat at our table. I've had luck at retirement homes. And holy cow if you have little kids, you are so welcome there (as long as you've met the administration and they feel comfortable with you). Joy disobeys the laws of thermodynamics and young children effortlessly generate joy in the elderly.
  • flyGuyOnTheSly 7y ago
    >I wish I could magically know who in the neighbourhood I could just knock on the door of and say hi and invite them to the extra seat at our table. You should be doing that the second that you or they setup shop in the new neighbourhood. It makes the christmastime awkwardness much less so! Because yea, just assuming that a random stranger is going to be lonely for christmas (whether they live down the street from you or not) could make for a really awkward time, I agree!
    • cm2012 7y ago
      The risk is if you talk to people are both lonely and annoying or toxic. They may never leave you alone!
      • flyGuyOnTheSly 7y ago
        Don't think of it as a risk. Think of it as an opportunity to show somebody how to live their lives in a meaningful way that does not harm or annoy other people.
    • Waterluvian 7y ago
      For sure. My wife and I rented for a few years and bought our house this summer. We've done a lot better job meeting people. A lot of people just kind of want to be left alone and you've got to be able to take that in stride and move on to saying hi to the next neighbours.
      • mlang23 7y ago
        "Kind of"? Nah, truly and really. Thats me. I am looking forward to christmas eve and the holidays afterwards being alone and having time for myself. Someone knocking on my door and offering to rescue me from this situation would be in for a very awkward situation indeed.
        • technothrasher 7y ago
          When you live in a friendly neighborhood, it doesn't have to be an awkward meeting. Our neighborhood is very often getting together casually for different things. Whenever a new neighbor moves in, one of us always goes and knocks on their door and says hello, gives them contact info, and mentions the next time we're getting together. If they show up or contact us, they're interested in being social. If they don't, they're welcome to their space. By the time holidays come around, we all know who might like to be together and who might not. No awkwardness either way.
  • forgotmypw 7y ago
    What is so horrible about awkwardness? I've witnessed people talk about it like it's the plague. It's just a bit of discomfort, and then you move on.
    • nothrabannosir 7y ago
      The point of social interactions is to connect with someone. If most of an interaction is awkward, you're not connecting. At that rate, you're just wasting time, and might as well do something alone. In the context of TFA, connecting is about filling a need for social interaction. That cannot be filled by awkwardness. If it's business or there's some other ulterior motive: sure.
      • mc3 7y ago
        I think the OP's motive here is to offer interaction to the other person who might be lonely. Not to make the OP feel good while not wasting time.
      • rdiddly 7y ago
        Yeah but the beginning of any relationship with anyone who's in any way different from you, is going to be awkward. If you push through that, you start to learn and get better at relating to that person, and they do the same. If you cut it off prematurely because it's awkward, then you just created the self-fulfilling prophecy that the entire relationship was awkward.
      • rexpop 7y ago
        Awkwardness is due to lack of social graces, and communication skills. Perhaps one can train on these in the absence of other, live humans--read, for example, "How to Work a Room," or "The Fine Art of Smalltalk"--but ultimately, one must learn to navigate awkwardness. In fact, I might go so far as to argue that the "connection" you're talking about is generated only by _resolving awkwardness_. Where there's none to resolve, there's no connection to be made. Relationships worn smooth by years of resolution aren't valuable in the same way.
        • 7y ago
  • foobiekr 7y ago
    When a bunch of us relocated to the Valley, we would do annual FriendsGiving and FriendsMas. As everyone has gotten older and busier, more stressed out or departed, that's kind of gone by the wayside. Later on when I had my startup, my cofounder and our manager-of-everything would find a place for all of the orphans who were like we had been - without anything to do for the holidays because they, too, had recently moved away from their social circle and family. Everyone wins. So I say: bid the awkwardness and putting yourself out there. I look back at that era fondly and yes, sometimes it was awkward, but mostly it was not. It was always worth it. (Ironically, this year all of our plans fell apart, so my wife and I are on our own.)
    • PakG1 7y ago
      If I wanted to do something like this, how would I find the orphans? I honestly don't know any grown-up orphans myself. There's definitely a matchmaking problem for finding certain people. Would I put up an ad on the Internet or in the streets saying, "Hey guys, holiday celebration happening, wanna invite all the orphans out there!" Or? Genuinely curious.
      • foobiekr 7y ago
        sorry for the lack of clarity; "orphans" here was our way of referring to employees who had moved across the country and had neither family [sometimes not in the US at all] nor social networks due to having moved cross-country to join us.
    • trevyn 7y ago
      I support this, but offer a word of caution: When we did a Friendsgiving, word got out and friends invited friends and we ended up hosting about 100 people. It was chaotic fun, but also a big lesson. ;)
  • ydb 7y ago
    > There's a matchmaking problem here. Absolutely agree. We need an efficient algorithm for matching based upon common interests, agreeability, and politeness. I wonder if matchmaking algorithms from video games would come in handy for this? I think the League of Legends queue algo would be perfect for this.
    • tomlockwood 7y ago
      Here's hoping I can break into plat.
• afarrell 7y ago
  As an immigrant (moved US->Southeast London) who probably won't be able to have kids, I find that I really wish there was a way to become an 'uncle' somehow. Modern society gives us a lot of choice and mobility, but also a lot of ways to find ourselves unrooted.
  • danharaj 7y ago
    The LGBTQ community originated the concept of "Chosen Family", people you willfully make a connection with as deep as blood family ties. As you can imagine, this is a particularly pressing need for people who are forcefully severed from their families, often at a very young age. Some of us have to work mindfully to get something many people take for granted. Hopefully naming the idea gives you a way to talk about it with other people.
    • Izkata 7y ago
      > The LGBTQ community originated the concept of "Chosen Family", people you willfully make a connection with as deep as blood family ties. I thought that started with the mafia..
      • Scarblac 7y ago
        Maybe in the future, the mafia will specialise in the two things it's really good at, pizza delivery _and_ helping people find social connections as deep as blood family ties?
        • jameskegel 7y ago
          I needed this.
  • wavefunction 7y ago
    Is there a Big Brothers/Big Sisters program in the UK? Or perhaps an opportunity to help serve meals to the elderly or homeless or impoverished? I tend to volunteer on holidays if I'm not headed to a family gathering. Meals on Wheels is a great program in the US and it involves a lot more than just dropping off food.
• jchallis 7y ago
  My mom must feel this lonely during the holidays . Simply brutal.
  • choeger 7y ago
    I have to wonder why you notice this and write it here? Can't you or don't you want to connect to her?
    • jchallis 7y ago
      Families often have more than two people and sympathy for their feelings means sometimes folks get left out. If your family gets to avoid this pain , count an extra blessing this holiday .
• fortran77 7y ago
  I'm not Christian, so I may have some terms wrong here, but: Isn't Christmas a religious holiday? Can she not attend a mass or a Christmas service and participate in Church events around the holidays? Isn't this one of the main functions the Church provides? Wouldn't there be many opportunities in nearly any Church for social activities? My local Jewish minyan is having an event tonight with a public menorah lighting, traditional food, games (including an Oculus VR Hanukkah experience!). There were plenty of opportunities to meet people the past few days and during the week. That's one of the functions of a religious community. We sent out public notices on Nextdoor, etc, and invited everybody in the community.
  • wavefunction 7y ago
    Christmas is both a religious and secular holiday. Jesus would have been born at some point of the year other than December according to the Bible, and Christmas (like Easter) was originally a pagan celebration that was likely co-opted intentionally.
    • giancarlostoro 7y ago
      Precisely. Christmas is definitely not Biblically inspired just adopted by the church. Elements such as Santa are definitely not Biblical. I am a Christian who doesnt celebrate Christmas because its origins are extrabiblical and pagan. The 7 feast days (Jewish holidays) are much more Biblical and Christian in my opinion. Even Easter is tainted because it was actually supposed to be the Passover (Pesach) but was based off a Pagan holiday instead. Despite the obvious there are many Christians who will defend Christmas to their dying breath. I have nothing against celbrating Christmas I just choose not to go out of my way to get a tree and I dont intend on lying to my kids about a fat man and toys.
      • havelhovel 7y ago
        I don't intend to lie to my children over ancient myths in general, but they can keep Christmas precisely because it's all in good fun.
      • 7y ago
• TeMPOraL 7y ago
  Interesting to see this here tonight. Just a few hours ago, my wife mentioned to me what she heard from some nurses: apparently, Christmas is one of the busiest times in hospitals, because a lot of people with elderly parents and grandparents would invent illnesses (or even cause them, by e.g. hiding or substituting medicine) to get them admitted to hospitals during Christmas, just to avoid having to have a Christmas dinner. She also told me that some time ago, there was an ad aired about this problem in Poland; it featured an elderly man who tried, year after year, to invite his family for Christmas, to no effect. He eventually posted a notice about his own funeral, and as the family came and was surprised to see him alive, he brought in the dinner and said, "because that was the only way I could get you here". Stories like this make me sick in my stomach. No matter the bad blood that can be present in a family, I just can't imagine how one can treat one's own parents this way.
  • Operyl 7y ago
    I feel like, with the man, it really depends. There’s some cases where the elderly parents may have caused so much trauma to a now grown child that they don’t want to have to interact with them again, which is unfortunately common with my friend group. Sometimes it’s just .. better that way.
  • TheAlchemist 7y ago
    It was actually in Germany, not in Poland, although it was also quite heavily discussed in Poland. Here is the ad: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4COtJ_5-dPM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4COtJ_5-dPM Edit: When I think about it, the most well known ad for Christmas in Poland is the one below - it's related to the fact that there are a huge number of young Poles that emigrated to the UK. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tU5Rnd-HM6A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tU5Rnd-HM6A
    • StavrosK 7y ago
      Ugh those scenes of him dressed up eating dinner alone are heartbreaking.
  • cm2012 7y ago
• brenden2 7y ago
  These are the kinds of problems I’d love to be able to figure out how to solve with technology.
  • adventskalender 7y ago
    Isn't that basically what dating apps are trying to do? I think "lighter" variants exists, for meeting friends, not just dates. Not that the situation couldn't be improved, though.
• lordleft 7y ago
  I come from a family of immigrants. Growing up, I at times felt oppressed by the constant throng of cousins and uncles and aunts and family friends at our home...but now that I'm older I greatly appreciate the dense social fabric that envelops my life. I sometimes think that the dark side of a society that extols individuality and independence is the possibility of immense alienation. I'm grateful to live in a country that creates space for self-expression and agency, but I sometimes think that for those who are not used to being part of a big community, life can become quite lonely.
  • dominotw 7y ago
    same. but extended family rarely gets along and really is a force of opression. My cousins family was stigmatized by the extended family when he came out as gay. He feels the constant guilt. All the extended families i've seen are full of gossip, jealousies and backstabbing. Maybe all those things make us human too i don't know.
  • dorchadas 7y ago
    It's something I'm struggling with now, tbh. I'm not an immigrant but my extended family is fairy close, even out to second cousins (my grandmother's brothers are super close to her, so our families get along; same with part of my grandfather's siblings), and I know I'll miss it. Yet, sadly, there's not many jobs here and if I stay I'll likely stay teaching, which isn't bad but I'm not sure how I long I'd last before burnout. I've got an offer to leave and study Quantitative Finance in a completely different country (one I want to move to and have visited many times) and am wondering if it's worth it. Man, it's difficult. Not to mention all my friends being here too (though I do have some in the new country, thankfully). Having that social inclusion and closeness is super nice, and I know I'd miss it.
• fizixer 7y ago
  Any loneliness discussion is incomplete in today's age, especially on a forum like HN, without a discussion on AI/conversation-bots.
• adventskalender 7y ago
  Why not meet up with other people in the same situation (possibly also elderly)? I have at times invited friends who didn't want to celebrate with their family. But a complete stranger would be too much for me (with little children).
• aussiegreenie 7y ago
  I host Christmas Orphans parties. Anyone who does not have a place can come and have lunch.
• kwijibob 7y ago
  Unpopular opinion, there is always more complexity and culpability in these sentimental stories. Even in the broken social fabric of Western culture, there are still many opportunities to contribute to and find genuine community. However it requires a sense of humility and focus on others overself. Among other things. I know of many 'lonely' people who are highly dysfunctional and have burned their family and other communities that have tried to engage them. Sometimes people do get a raw deal and are genuine victims. Other times people reap the whirlwind of their own bad behaviours and attitudes. Sometimes a mix of both. Life is messy.
• spodek 7y ago
  People will likely create an app for this, not realizing they're contributing to the culture creating situations like this.
• ngngngng 7y ago
  Shout out to religion here. Everyone in my faith is assigned one or two people to "minister" to and everyone also has someone ministering to them. Instant friends. And no need for the elderly to be completely alone and have to turn to craigslist. I can't imagine this need going unfilled in the structure of my local church community. Obviously with the decline of religion, this situation will only become more common. People need a built in community structure, and nothing has stepped up to replace church yet. I don't think r/atheism is going to fill that void anytime soon.
  • anonu 7y ago
    Curious to know which religion you follow? How does assignment work? I suppose they need to be part of the same congregation?
    • ngngngng 7y ago
      The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, or as we're often known, Mormons. There's a mens group and a womens group, and the leaders of each of these groups make the assignments and then hear reports on how everyone's doing. All of this happens within a single congregation, or "ward" as we call them. And wards are dictated by location. So there's no concept of "church shopping" within this religion, which helps with organizational efforts like this.
      • heyitsguay 7y ago
        It's awesome that you have found community through your religion, but you (and everybody else reading this comment who doesn't already know) should be aware that the Mormon religion was founded as a cult of personality by the con-man Joseph Smith. I am not saying this to pass judgement on you or any practitioners, but anybody interested in conversion should be aware of what they are getting into. Ample resources exist to support this claim, due to Joseph Smith living only a couple hundred years ago and leaving many contemporary sources outside the church who reported on his early life and motivations in the foundational years of the church.
• didibus 7y ago
  Sometimes I feel it's only the crappy people who need families. The people not enjoyable enough for others to willingly choose to put up with them, they need a form of forced social duty and enact it through guilt and pitty. That said, especially for elderly people, it could just be circumstances of life that has played into them being lonely. The issue is, if I'm to open up and invite a stranger in, how do I know which category they belong in? I feel probability wise, chances are they're of the former, and are probably boring, judgmental, uptight, have issues, etc. Which is why they're lonely in the first place. So while I'd be okay opening up to lovely people, the risk of doing so is too high right now, without it happening organically.
  • caseysoftware 7y ago
    > The issue is, if I'm to open up and invite a stranger in, how do I know which category they belong in? I feel probability wise, chances are they're of the former, and are probably boring, judgmental, uptight, have issues, etc. Which is why they're lonely in the first place. You don't know which category and that's okay. No one is encouraging you become bffs, let them move in, or even to see them ever again. It's chatting and getting to know someone in a different place in life than you. If you only let people in your life who are not-boring, not-judgemental, not-uptight, issue-free, etc, you run the risk of being more like the person you'd reject over the person you'd welcome.
    • kome 7y ago
      > If you only let people in your life who are not-boring, not-judgemental, not-uptight, issue-free, etc, you run the risk of being more like the person you'd reject over the person you'd welcome. this is SO true. Everybody complaining about "awkwardness" as a big deal must have had a pretty sheltered life...
  • wyqydsyq 7y ago
    I've seen people saying elsewhere this story was shared that they lived in the area and replied to the CL post, the lady turned out to be some crazy nutjob and it became apparent that there were very good reasons that she had nobody to spend Christmas with.
• rb808 7y ago
  One thing I don't understand about American culture is thanksgiving and how it interracts with Christmas. If your family meets up for thanksgiving does that mean Christmas isn't so important to meet up with extended family? We have an elderly neighbour who has 3 children and I'm horrified to find out she'll be alone at Christmas, but they all met up just a few weeks ago so I'm not sure if its normal or not.
  • caseysoftware 7y ago
    It really depends on a variety of things. If people are spread out geographically, if they travel for one, they don't for the other. If people are relatively local, often one holiday is with one side of the family while the other holiday is the other. After a generation of couples having 2-3 kids and those kids growing up to have 1-2 kids, it makes sense that "extended" families aren't all that extended any more. One of my grandmothers was the oldest of 7, while both my parents were oldest of two, and I'm the oldest of two. Add in our physical distances and it's easy through honest poor scheduling (vs malice) for a grandparent, sibling, etc to be 100% on their own for a holiday.
  • toasterlovin 7y ago
    As an American, I wish we would just combine Thanksgiving and Christmas and take a week off. The mere month between major holidays is weird. And, culturally, Christmas is a bigger deal, but Thanksgiving has the guaranteed long weekend, so it’s the one you can count on traveling for.
    • krapht 7y ago
      Thanksgiving is for one side of the family, Christmas for the other. Isn't that how most people do it?
    • Marsymars 7y ago
      Or move it to October, like Canada, since Americans don't seem to get a holiday in October.
• 0x8BADF00D 7y ago
  Just want to chime in that there is nothing wrong with spending your time alone during the holidays. I have family but I’d rather travel during this time for leisure. What’s so bad about being alone? I prefer it honestly. It allows me to contemplate on the past year and reflect on myself. With family all you will get is petty family politics, gossip, bringing up things that happened years ago, etc.
  • echelon 7y ago
    Do this every year for the next twenty and see if you feel the same way. In the case of elders, they often lack any tangible social contact. Let alone with that of their own families. A small subset of people will be fine living life completely aloof, but we're social animals -- this would drive the majority of us crazy.
  • rocqua 7y ago
    I imagine things are difficult if you already feel lonely outside of the holidays. At that point, having to be alone during them, when you know and see that so many others do have company, it really stings. Outside the holidays being alone can be 'an accident of circumstance'. During them, being alone can feel like confirmation there is no-one for you. (Note, not my feelings, no need to worry)
• eirini1 7y ago
  >The woman in Tulsa, who identified herself only as Carrie, said she had been fighting cancer and was estranged from her daughter, who has refused to let her see her granddaughter even though both live close by. >“I really thought the feeling would go away, but my heart is so broken,” she said in an email. She posted the ad on Dec. 11, then went to her granddaughter’s dance studio and sat outside, hoping to catch a peek of her through the window. interesting that this is sprinkled in there, this is super weird boundary breaking behavior. I wonder if its related to why they no longer talk.
  • mlang23 7y ago
    This is a pretty clear case of stalking. When children cut the connection to their parents, it is super easy to side with the poor mother. However, people tend to ignore that the pressure for the children must have been quite high to go to such an extend. This makes me sad, since I know how it feels if your parents dont respect boundaries.
    • deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
  • aguyfromnb 7y ago
    A desperate, lonely person, facing mortality, does what they can to see people she loves but isn't allowed to visit due to estrangement? That's "super weird" to you?
    • eirini1 7y ago
      it does point to a pattern. Both me and the rest of my real family don't talk to our bio families anymore and this kind of stalking behavior is something I'd expect out of one of one of those boomer assholes! objectively its super weird though, and also not strictly legal.
  • rahidz 7y ago
    That and the throwaway sentence near the end: >In the end, Carrie said she decided to spend Christmas with friends. Wait, all this time she had friends to spend time with? Honestly this seems more like her complaining about her estrangement from her family, than it does about being lonely. I bet the estranged daughter's story would read a lot differently, and would love to read it.
• jelliclesfarm 7y ago
  I really dislike emotional article titles like this. There is a bond or there isn’t. Honestly, I feel like it’s better if we can ‘retire’ emotionally like we do from a job. Getting old is inevitable(for now)..when someone is in their 60s-70s, their children are probably in their middle age dealing with their own families and crises. Children are insurance for our genetic material. Not financial or emotional crutches. Some might not feel that way, but I think having expectations and cultivating detachment as one grows older is a better attitude. Heck! I have been trying to cultivate detachment from the time I hit 35 and it’s a process. I hope to get it right by my 5th or 6th decade, at least!
• YarickR2 7y ago
  God I need one . So damn lonely in the LA suburbs; moved from Russia, no friends, no coworkers, no relatives, basically it'll be a usual day in the office for me. I could cook a meal, but I have noone to share it with.
  • rocqua 7y ago
    :( all I have for you are internet hugs. Wish I could do more.
  • ryaan_anthony 7y ago
    Living in a densely populated city like LA just compounds the loneliness as you are constantly surrounded by happy people and groups of friends/family. I went through it myself for a few years. The best thing i did was to go find a random spot to eat out. Eating alone used to be really hard for me, but i got over it and i would come home feeling 100% better mood.
• hackedoff 7y ago
  I was reading this post and found it interesting enough to reply too. I am also a grandma so I know what pleasure it is. I had a son and a daughter, my son died when he was in his early 20's, he had one daughter that I do not get to see. I was blessed with a daughter that shared her kids with me, I always thanked her and I knew without a doubt I was very blessed. 14 and a half years I pretty much raised these kids, I didn't ask to but was more than happy to do so. Mom and dad were good parents until my son died then the second child was born and something happened. They weren't interested in the kids at all, they were consumed with computer games. Then came a third child, my daughter kept getting more and more violent toward me but as long as it was toward me we were fine I just wanted the kids to be safe. Long story short, after 14 and a half years of being with these kids daily, living with the girls the last 2 years my daughter turned into someone I didn't recognize anymore, she was violent toward me and the kids. We lived in the same house I was in the basement they were upstairs, I kept the payment up on the house and other bills because they wouldn't they took my money but didn't pay the bills. It got very dangerous with my daughter so I tried to help my grandkids. In the emotional state of mind I was in everything I did turned out backwards.My daughter lied of course to everyone said I was controlling and wouldn't let her raise her kids. I am sure she looked this stuff up on line. I fell apart because of what my daughter was saying. I ended up seeing a councellor trying to get back on track, dfs gave the kids back to mom and dad, mom and dad high tailed it out of the state with the kids leaving behind loans they took out and never repaid. With the help of DFS and other people my son in law and daughter were able to change the kids, immediately I hesitate to put this in here because I have been accused of so many things in order to make me look bad. Mom and dad left the state and I have tried to talk to the kids on pinterest but they told on me. Im guessing that's how they get their attention. I worrt about them daily how is this going to affect them, I have had the hardest time understanding how you could turn one human against another, the parents and others told the two girls that grandma didn't want them, they made the girls feel like I didn't love them and I never did. They have somehow convinced these two girls of this. I have not been allowed to see these kids in two years, this has actually been harder to deal with than my sons death. My sister is on GitHub here and she creates hacks to watch me constantly. The harrassment has been horrible. Its been very heartbreaking and eye opening. Parents can have mental problems but if they have never been arrested for drugs then they are good people. My heart has just been shattered, I used to sit along the bus route hoping to see their bus go by just to get the tiniest glimpse, I meant no harm I was just so homesick for them. Lately I have been needing to hear their voices. Im deemed as a bad grandma but I never lied I never did anything against my daughter I didn't even bye presents for them without asking. So the point of this post don't always assume grandma has done wrong just because mommy said she did, maybe mommy has some problems of her own. I feel so badly for any grandmother that has to be away from their grandkids right now. Have a merry Christmas and thanks for letting me post!
• Angostura 7y ago
  Anyone from the UK, I would urge to join up for https://www.ageuk.org.uk/services/befriending-services/sign-up-for-telephone-befriending/ https://www.ageuk.org.uk/services/befriending-services/sign-... It’s a brilliantly organized scheme - you get online training and a telephone interview before you go live and it just requires you to give up 30 minutes of your time a week to talk and listen for 30 minutes. I signed up and it is brilliant- and so well organized