3 ms·

Legislating salary transparency would be quite awesome actually. And as others have pointed out, in some countries you can call tax office and ask how much anot

Legislating salary transparency would be quite awesome actually. And as others have pointed out, in some countries you can call tax office and ask how much another person has earned in the last year. And I do believe that every company needs to get very transparent on how they decide the salary, when they pay someone differently. There should be a well-designed set of rules and processes to follow. This way, people who want to earn more, know exactly what to do and in which direction should they grow and develop. Also, if they think that this direction doesn’t align with their personal goals, they can make a better decision about joining another company, where interests will align better.

hiram112 7y ago
> Legislating salary transparency would be quite awesome actually. I've heard they do this in one or more Scandinavian countries. Essentially, you can go online and see what your coworkers and neighbors earn. I have a feeling that's why salaries in these countries, especially when you include state defined insurance and pension plans, are so normalized. It's probably also why more innovation tends to take place in the US (subjectively). For many of us in the US, I think this would actually be a net negative, myself included. There is so much division in this country, eventually employers will simply be forced to dish out nearly identical salaries for everyone in order to avoid lawsuits and government penalties, even when talent and performance is radically different between employees. For example, Employee X has a BS in CS from a great engineering school which took a lot of effort to obtain. He was hacking away at code on his own as a teenager and is passionate about tech, and is often working on open source projects on weekends and evenings. Another employee comes in - she got a watered-down "Information Systems" degree from some mediocre pay-to-play online school, and her previous knowledge of technology is her IPhone and Facebook. She pays her tutition fees, does the minimum to graduate, and now has her BS, too. She discovers the talented guy make 50% more than her, even though he's the guy leading the development projects, ensuring standards are met, cleaning up the garbage produced by other junior coders, etc. We all know that many teams form this dynamic, especially in typical contracting and enterprise shops. Well of course she'll complain. They both have similar 'credentials' on paper, both work 40 hours, both are in their 30s. Management won't care that one dev is worth 5x the other, they want to avoid lawsuits and government penalties. So his salary is lowered, hers is raised. Because he knows he won't get paid what he's worth anywhere else since it's the same everywhere, he just stop performing at work, the whole project suffers. And yes, this has happened in my work place several times in the last few years as salaries have become more transparent and there are more complaints from groups who feel that they're being discriminated against, regardless of their performance and experience.
- ChrisMarshallNY 7y ago
  You are correct, which is why I think a bonus system would work better. The problem with bonuses, is that they are very easy to abuse, and many corporations have incredibly rigid bonus systems that actually make it difficult to reward individual excellence. I was just talking with a friend of mine a couple of days ago. He's a Director at a manufacturing plant, and is awesome. He spent the last year, working 7 days a week, ten hours a day, to implement some new processes. The company is being put out to bid for sale, and his efforts doubled the price. His efforts alone. Doubled the price of the company. He got a tiny raise, and all Directors get the same bonus, based on sales numbers (which weren't so good). Also, all Directors get the same percentage of equity. I suspect that he may be seeing who else could use his talents...
  - blackearl 7y ago
    Working that hard for someone else is stupid. Unless you hold the reins, I wouldn't expect management to suddenly have their hearts grow 10 times larger at the expense of their own compensation.
    - waterlink 7y ago
      I agree with this. No matter how much I love the company, their mission, or people I work with, it’s not healthy to work 7 days a week and 10h a day for the company that you are not an owner of. Boundaries between job and life are flexible, but not as much. I’d rather spend 10h a day 7 days a week pouring efforts into my own assets, or towards my vision, and not for someone else’s assets or vision, especially if I have no say and stake in the high level decisions (like sale of the company).
- pnutjam 7y ago
  This says alot about your biases... I would have assumed that the person learning on their own, working on open source projects, and hacking away on stuff since they were a kid went to the mediocre school. They just need the paper to open the gates. The person who went to the "top-tier" school is more likely to be working the system and generally turning in garbage at work. Their parents have a buddy on the board, or the department is run by a frat/sorority acquaintance, or they just get extra consideration because "top-tier" school resume. An yes, I've seen this at many places over the years... Guess who the first whiner is?

hiram112 7y ago

> Legislating salary transparency would be quite awesome actually. I've heard they do this in one or more Scandinavian countries. Essentially, you can go online and see what your coworkers and neighbors earn. I have a feeling that's why salaries in these countries, especially when you include state defined insurance and pension plans, are so normalized. It's probably also why more innovation tends to take place in the US (subjectively). For many of us in the US, I think this would actually be a net negative, myself included. There is so much division in this country, eventually employers will simply be forced to dish out nearly identical salaries for everyone in order to avoid lawsuits and government penalties, even when talent and performance is radically different between employees. For example, Employee X has a BS in CS from a great engineering school which took a lot of effort to obtain. He was hacking away at code on his own as a teenager and is passionate about tech, and is often working on open source projects on weekends and evenings. Another employee comes in - she got a watered-down "Information Systems" degree from some mediocre pay-to-play online school, and her previous knowledge of technology is her IPhone and Facebook. She pays her tutition fees, does the minimum to graduate, and now has her BS, too. She discovers the talented guy make 50% more than her, even though he's the guy leading the development projects, ensuring standards are met, cleaning up the garbage produced by other junior coders, etc. We all know that many teams form this dynamic, especially in typical contracting and enterprise shops. Well of course she'll complain. They both have similar 'credentials' on paper, both work 40 hours, both are in their 30s. Management won't care that one dev is worth 5x the other, they want to avoid lawsuits and government penalties. So his salary is lowered, hers is raised. Because he knows he won't get paid what he's worth anywhere else since it's the same everywhere, he just stop performing at work, the whole project suffers. And yes, this has happened in my work place several times in the last few years as salaries have become more transparent and there are more complaints from groups who feel that they're being discriminated against, regardless of their performance and experience.

ChrisMarshallNY 7y ago
You are correct, which is why I think a bonus system would work better. The problem with bonuses, is that they are very easy to abuse, and many corporations have incredibly rigid bonus systems that actually make it difficult to reward individual excellence. I was just talking with a friend of mine a couple of days ago. He's a Director at a manufacturing plant, and is awesome. He spent the last year, working 7 days a week, ten hours a day, to implement some new processes. The company is being put out to bid for sale, and his efforts doubled the price. His efforts alone. Doubled the price of the company. He got a tiny raise, and all Directors get the same bonus, based on sales numbers (which weren't so good). Also, all Directors get the same percentage of equity. I suspect that he may be seeing who else could use his talents...
- blackearl 7y ago
  Working that hard for someone else is stupid. Unless you hold the reins, I wouldn't expect management to suddenly have their hearts grow 10 times larger at the expense of their own compensation.
  - waterlink 7y ago
    I agree with this. No matter how much I love the company, their mission, or people I work with, it’s not healthy to work 7 days a week and 10h a day for the company that you are not an owner of. Boundaries between job and life are flexible, but not as much. I’d rather spend 10h a day 7 days a week pouring efforts into my own assets, or towards my vision, and not for someone else’s assets or vision, especially if I have no say and stake in the high level decisions (like sale of the company).
pnutjam 7y ago
This says alot about your biases... I would have assumed that the person learning on their own, working on open source projects, and hacking away on stuff since they were a kid went to the mediocre school. They just need the paper to open the gates. The person who went to the "top-tier" school is more likely to be working the system and generally turning in garbage at work. Their parents have a buddy on the board, or the department is run by a frat/sorority acquaintance, or they just get extra consideration because "top-tier" school resume. An yes, I've seen this at many places over the years... Guess who the first whiner is?