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Huawei expected to surpass Apple to become world’s No 2 phone maker
- bhouston 7y agoSo the US sanctions on Huawei, that were intended to be crippling and were fairly abrupt and harsh, had only a minor effect on Huawei. That should scare the shit out of the US government. It means that China is much more self-sufficient in technology than they figured. The future of high technology at this time does seem to be in the hands of China with the rest of the world contributing a bit. I suspect OSes and architectural chip designs are one of the last things that China hasn't really developed home grown in a successful way, but it is likely next. Thus taking on directly Microsoft Windows, Android, ARM and Intel.
- ehnto 7y agoThe leverage the US has over China is in manufacturing anyway. Huawei sanctions were a red herring.
- nrp 7y agoAnd pork, apparently: https://www.fpri.org/article/2019/12/pork-apocalypse-african-swine-fever-and-the-u-s-china-trade-war/ https://www.fpri.org/article/2019/12/pork-apocalypse-african...
- Hydraulix989 7y agoThis posting's article also had a side bar link to a suggested article on the same news site, CN Tech Post. China is releasing its own OS, too (Unity OS -- UOS): https://cntechpost.com/2019/12/13/china-made-operating-system-releases-first-version/ https://cntechpost.com/2019/12/13/china-made-operating-syste...
- gman83 7y agoIt's just a rebranded version of Deepin Linux.
- yorwba 7y agoWhich is Debian with a custom Qt-based desktop environment.
- ForHackernews 7y ago> It has perfect functions, smooth experience and stable quality. Sounds flawless...
- gardaani 7y agoTheir plan is to replace foreign PCs and software in all government offices and public institutions in three years. It means replacing 20-30 million PCs! That will definitely also accelerate the OS development. https://www.ft.com/content/b55fc6ee-1787-11ea-8d73-6303645ac406 https://www.ft.com/content/b55fc6ee-1787-11ea-8d73-6303645ac...
- ses1984 7y agoI thought the sanctions on Huawei were about stopping the penetration of Chinese devices into American networks and businesses for security reasons.
- sct202 7y agoThe original sanction charge on Huawei was for selling American equipment to Iran, and all the financial transactions related to hiding that. Stealing trade secrets and patent infringement is usually fine and a block on specific products and were tacked on later.
- jdsully 7y agoThe official reason is that they exported US tech to Iran. But its pretty obvious the whole thing is political. Even trump contradicted the official reason a day later.
- jacquesm 7y ago> Even trump contradicted the official reason a day later. It would by now be more worrying if he didn't.
- fredmorcos 7y agoThat's what they tell you.
- LatteLazy 7y agoNo one has actually managed to find and actual security reasons not to accept Huawei devices. There were some really poorly informed stories that listed standard features (telnet support in routers) and tried to play them up as a sinister commie plot but they were all pretty laughable. Most countries (for instance here in the UK) assess infrastructure equipment, providers can only buy from the approved and have for decades. Huawei always passed those tests with flying colours. But I guess "chinese spies eat telecoms babies" is a much more dramatic headline...
- ses1984 7y ago
- yorwba 7y ago> So the US sanctions on Huawei, that were intended to be crippling and were fairly abrupt and harsh, had only a minor effect on Huawei. Of course they had only a minor effect, since they were always postponed to some future date. [1] The sanctions weren't intended to be crippling and harsh, but to threaten becoming crippling and harsh unless China makes certain concessions. So long as the concessions remain on the table, the sanctions remain off the table. [1] Currently February 16, 2020 apparently: https://www.datacenterdynamics.com/news/us-government-postpones-huawei-ban-another-90-days/ https://www.datacenterdynamics.com/news/us-government-postpo...
- LatteLazy 7y agoWhen the sanctions came out, I was surprised that Apple and Google DIDNT go nuclear. It seems pretty obvious that the nation of China won't just voluntarily give up all it's western smart phones. So the only other medium term alternative would be to begin work on a domestic OS. Apple and Google (and the US economy and tech sector by extension) are the big losers from that, China the big gainer. It's not quite Tin Foil Hat time, but I also wondered: if the chinese government had tried to ban foreign OSs and force a homegrown equivalent it would have been resisted at home and abroad it would have spurred (real) sanctions and possibly upset the (lucrative, strategically valuable) hardware supply chain. Trump doing it was a great way for the Chinese government to get what it wanted without looking like the bad guy (it might even be able to play the victim, especially at home). Given the predictability of these outcomes, one has to wonder: was Trump incompetent (he expected a different outcome) or was he serving a different agenda (maybe a trump hotel in Beijing is about to be approved?).
- sidibe 7y agoGoogle has little to lose from Chinese sanctions and probably gains from competitors being hurt.
- kube-system 7y agoThe US government was never primarily concerned about handsets sales or technical superiority. The primary issue has always been a concern of supply-chain governance for critical infrastructure, i.e. carriers networks. The US doesn't have any of these concerns about European 5G equipment manufacturers because they are close allies. The US has a high degree of confidence that the governments of Sweden and Finland aren't going to pressure Nokia or Ericsson to compromise the support or supply-chain of US 5G infrastructure.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- ci5er 7y agoThe handset business is mouse nuts economically and nobody cares at any level of national security what idiot consumers do to themselves. The "National Security" concern (economically, technologically, capability and integrity-wise) is at the carrier level. Think Cisco, not iPhone.
- balls187 7y ago> That should scare the shit out of the US government. The US outspends the next 7 countries in defense, combined. Regarding actual economic sanctions are a very effective weapon in US Foreign policy. Aside from it's military might, the US is one of the biggest players in the global economic market. That allows it to wield incredible leverage.
- remir 7y agoThe future of high technology at this time does seem to be in the hands of China with the rest of the world contributing a bit. I highly doubt this. So far, what China has done is producing lower cost equivalent to products already developed by other nations. I don't see how China is leading the pack in terms of innovation, here. Beside, I don't think we can consider smart phones to be "high technology" anymore. The market is saturated with them and the innovation has slowed down massively since a couple of years ago.
- bhouston 7y agoI have heard this refrain from those in the west for decades about china. During those two decades China has exceeded every attempt to keep them at a certain level of development. I do not see that stopping.
- remir 7y agoWhen China will invent game changing technology that benefit the world in a massive way, then we'll be able to say they're leaders.
- dr_dshiv 7y agoI use a Huawei - it takes surprisingly great photos and is generally well made. Some annoying software pop-ups, though. I guess the worst part is that I feel the need to loudly state that "I support the actions of the Chinese government" on a regular basis, just to be safe.
- euix 7y agoHuawei is just like Apple in my mind. An overly expensive premium phone with bells and whistles I don't need. I had a ZTE for many years that is finally bricking. After this I will probably get some $100 phone from one of those millions of unknown Shenzhen OEMs, UMIDIGI or something.
- esquire_900 7y agoDepends which one you buy I guess? I bought an Huawei Y7 2019 a year or so ago which is surprisingly good, around 160 euro's.
- ChrisSD 7y agoHuawei have long done good phones in the roughly £100 to £200 range. They tend to be arguably the best hardware for their price. But as mentioned, the software isn't perfect so you'll either need to put up with some annoyances or be willing to hack around it.
- jandrese 7y agoHow is the Cyanogen/LineageOS coverage on Huawei? It seems like if you want updates after a couple of years you'd best make sure your phone isn't locked out from aftermarket ROMs.
- yorwba 7y agoLineageOS supports 5 different Huawei devices: https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/#huawei https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/#huawei The last time I bought a phone, I consulted that list first and compared all recent entries without fixating on a specific manufacturer. I ended up with a Xiaomi Mi A1 that's been holding up well so far and already went through one major Android update without problem.
- itg 7y agoNot surprising when phones coming from Chinese brands have on par/better specs for a quarter of the price.
- andreilys 7y agoYes not surprising when Huawei and others have been accused of stealing trade secrets. Why invest in R&D when you can just steal the IP from others? https://www.wsj.com/articles/huaweis-yearslong-rise-is-littered-with-accusations-of-theft-and-dubious-ethics-11558756858 https://www.wsj.com/articles/huaweis-yearslong-rise-is-litte...
- nsporillo 7y agoPrecisely. When you can manufacture dirt cheap, steal the innovation of others, then work your white collar to the bone (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/996_working_hour_system). It is not surprising they can afford to undercut competitors and dump goods onto the market.
- ASalazarMX 7y agoWould you expect any developing country to not take advantage advantage in the same situation? At a state level, it would be stupid to attract manufacturing with cheap labor, materials, lax ambient laws and low taxes and not copy the technology. Only an inept government would willingly stall the development of its own country to honorably respect those trade secrets. Everybody doing business with China knew, but the economical incentive was too great to pass.
- riversflow 7y ago“Developing”. They are the #2 economy.
- yorwba 7y agoIt doesn't make sense to look at the absolute size of an economy to determine development status. A country full of subsistence farmers can be #1 economy if they're numerous enough. China's GDP per capita (PPP) is still less than a third of that of the US, somewhere between Azerbaijan and the Dominican Republic.
- rotten 7y agoLA Time article on Huawei that came out this week with lots of background on the sanctions and issues with their technology: https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fg-huawei-timeline/ https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fg-huawei-timeline/
- rotten 7y agoI work for Finite State, one of the companies mentioned in that article. Here is more information on that report: https://finitestate.io/2019/06/26/report-finds-cybersecurity.. https://finitestate.io/2019/06/26/report-finds-cybersecurity.... And here is a video of our CEO talking more about it: https://finitestate.io/2019/10/03/security-weekly-podcast https://finitestate.io/2019/10/03/security-weekly-podcast
- Nokinside 7y agoAccording to Counterpoint Research Samsung is #1, Second is BBK Electronics with 20% of the global smartphone market and is close to becoming the largest manufacturer in the near future. Brand comparisons ignore BBK Electronics because they sell multiple brands: One Plus, Oppo, Vivo and Realme. Huawei is ahead of Apple because Huawei sells also HONOR branded smartphones. 2019Q3 Samsung 21% (*BBK 20%) Huawei 18% Apple 12% *Oppo 9% Xiaomi 8% *vivo 8% *Realme 3% https://www.counterpointresearch.com/global-smartphone-share/ https://www.counterpointresearch.com/global-smartphone-share... Chinese brands have almost 50% global market share.
- dep_b 7y agoGood info. Still I think that they're not making a lot of money and the market's contracting too. Looks a bit like the situation with laptops about 10 years ago. They were dirt cheap and abundant. --- edit --- https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/12/19/apple-earned-66-of-the-entire-smartphone-markets-profits-in-2019 https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/12/19/apple-earned-66-o... 66% to Apple, 17% to Samsung and the rest is fighting for the scraps. Which is actually better than a while ago where Apple + Samsung > 100% because the rest was losing money. Already quite a few brands have left the market.
- eloff 7y agoWhen people ask me if they should buy Apple, I tell them it's overpriced for the hardware you get. Your linked article proves my point quite nicely. But then I follow that up with the value is in the software, if you like/are familiar with Apple software, then buy Apple despite the cost. I prefer Android and Linux, so I avoid Apple products for myself.
- dep_b 7y ago> it's overpriced for the hardware you get. That's only a problem when you view a product as just a bunch of discrete parts' summed value. A MacBook Pro is a macOS dongle that also happens to be one of the - if not the - best ultrabooks you can get.
- adriantam 7y agoLego is the world's No 1 wheel maker. Michelin is far behind Lego in counts. But when you need a wheel for your car, you look for Michelin. Same here. Huawei phone and Apple phone are for different market. You shouldn't compare like that.
- davidy123 7y agoThat's a very clever but insulting comparison. iPhone and Android (and etc) are both clearly smartphones with the same general features. I have to use an iPhone for work. I try to get the most out of it, but am constantly surprised how primitive and clunky it is compared to the Android experience.
- have_faith 7y agoThis is the exact experience I have as an iPhone user using Android. Perhaps a difference in requirements and expectations.
- davidy123 7y agoWhat I mean is, excluding add-ons (especially Google ones), the default mail program, photo managing, synchronization, smart assistant, as well as small but important features like being able to search in settings all seem so much less developed. Apple has been ahead of Android in some cases, and takes a safer path, but especially having to use a locked-down iPhone (we have Android-based Samsung as an option, but I like to contrast) I'm constantly surprised at the experience.
- saiya-jin 7y agoNever had an Apple product so no personal experience - colleague recently bought an Apple flagship phone (I think previous gen before current gen came). After few days he was hugely disappointed how little he can tweak the device. What is there works fine, but that can be also said about phones for 20% of the price. For him, there was nothing more that would justify the price. When he sees how much horsepower I have with my Xiaomi mi 9 for 1/3rd of the price, he wants to cry. It makes better photos too. His biggest regret in electronics shopping so far. That comparison must obviously disregard privacy concerns, but I find it foolish to expect any kind of privacy, on any phone, Apple included. Hence no critical, single point of failure apps there.
- codedokode 7y agoThe good things in Chinese smartphones are their price and that they sometimes have clean Android version without bloatware. Why do vendors like Samsung make their ugly buggy shells and pre-install software I don't need? Do they think they have better designers and developers that Google has? They are horribly wrong. Stop pretending that you are making something unique and maybe I will consider buying a non-chinese phone next time.
- akmarinov 7y agoThey do it do differentiate their phones. If all phones look the same and basically have the same hardware - why bother buying Samsung, when a cheap Oppo is the exact same phone? Then Samsung won't make lots of money. This way you can have Samsung fanboys that'll swear that Samsung stuff is better and will keep buying it.
- _trampeltier 7y agoWrong. I buy the Samsung Notebecause it has a pen. And I also hate all the Samsung Android Addons.
- akmarinov 7y agoThere are other manufacturers that so pens as well...
- aianus 7y ago> If all phones look the same and basically have the same hardware - why bother buying Samsung, when a cheap Oppo is the exact same phone? Because Samsung is made outside of China and will not be tariffed.
- akmarinov 7y agoCountries outside of the US exist.
- Iwan-Zotow 7y ago