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"and you get cancel cultured (some cases, it's justified. But is it always?)" Feels like you're just trying to make a political comment here. Do you have a li

"and you get cancel cultured (some cases, it's justified. But is it always?)" Feels like you're just trying to make a political comment here. Do you have a list of Youtubers who were unjustly "cancelled"? The way you phrase it "sometimes justified... but not always" makes it sound like you're familiar with unfairly "cancelled" youtubers, so I'm curious. If it were just one youtuber who was unjustly cancelled you wouldn't have written "some cases, justified" which implicitly means "most cases, unjustified" so I'd really love to see evidence that your implicit claim that most cases are unjustified isn't just a cheap political jab

JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
My comment is about the financial risks in being a YouTube star: there's a risk you lose your income abruptly, but I suppose you could be fired from a normal job. Companies go under; CEOs get canned. I promise, my intent was not political. I do, however, feel the risks are higher in YouTube because what you say is more subject to public scrutiny. Your colleagues aren't going to advocate for your removal at work for what you say outside of work hours around your friends in a social setting. But when you're a public figure, or representing brands in videos, even those little moments become subject to criticism. YouTube stars' lives blend professional and personal spheres in ways that ordinary careers do not.
- criley2 7y ago
  So, to be clear, you cannot think of a single youtuber who was "cancelled" unjustly, despite writing a statement which implied that most of the cases were unjust as a rule? To be frank, this is exactly what I thought, and really calls into question why you would make such a biased and baseless comment. Your criticism appears to have nothing to do with youtube at all, and is a general criticism of public life and how being a public figure opens you up to greater scrutiny both from the platforms you use publicly as well as the audiences you reach. Which, while true, is a truism that is far older than the internet... or electricity... or democracy...
  - JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
    The difference between other public figures, such as politicians, presidents, and movie stars is they make millions of dollars per year. YouTube stars usually don't. They're putting all of the time and little money they have into something so fragile, so easily broken. PewDiePie mentions this in his video about taking a break: He did not expect a YouTube career to be a possible, long-sustaining venture. He expected, maybe 1-2 years of success and then it'd fizzle out, though that's not what happened. This paragraph is my criticism specifically with YouTube. It enabled lower and middle class people, who don't have the financial security to handle the realities of life as a public figure, to become public figures. Why do you need me to name a person impacted by cancel culture? The discussion shouldn't latch onto one person's particular situation. I have enough empathy in me to believe that some people impacted by cancel culture regret their actions, and are given no opportunity to make amends, and I think that's toxic and it encourages people to be further more toxic, because they're given no other option than to double down. Cancel culture is a very new phenomena and is not as old as electricity or democracy.
    - hsod 7y ago
      > Why do you need me to name a person impacted by cancel culture? The discussion shouldn't latch onto one person's particular situation. I have enough empathy in me to believe that some people impacted by cancel culture regret their actions, and are given no opportunity to make amends, and I think that's toxic and it encourages people to be further more toxic, because they're given no other option than to double down. Cancel culture is a very new phenomena and is not as old as electricity or democracy. I think the issue here is that you haven't given any clear explanation of what you believe "cancel culture" to be, and seem unwilling or unable to give a single example of it. Without an example or at least a clear explanation, it's hard to evaluate your concerns about people "given no opportunity to make amends". For instance, I recall pewdiepie said the N word on stream and got some backlash, apologized, and moved on with his very popular channel. Is that cancel culture?
    - criley2 7y ago
      "Why do you need me to name a person impacted by cancel culture? Because you lied to push a biased and false political narrative, and when challenged, you admitted it. I wanted you to substantiate your beliefs because I knew you had fallen for bad propaganda, and I hoped that by demanding evidence, you would re-evaluate your biased position, realize it was not founded on reality or evidence, and grow as a person. I hoped in some small way to cure this propaganda infection, and inoculate you against future attacks on your concept of reality. Obviously, that failed. P.S. if you think everyone in the public is millionaires only, you live an extremely ignorant or privileged life. Almost none of the politicians, news reporters, actors on television, athletes are millionaires. It's very rare to be a millionaire and only the top of the top are. The vast majority of everyone you see on television or read on the internet are not a millionaires. If you think Youtube is a grinder, check out College Football and the NFL. See how many kids give their bodies, their health, their lives and only 1/1000 even make it, and of that number, generally only 1/100 will sign a major million+ contract. Want another example? Check out YCombinator, the culture of over-work, hackers, start-ups, entrepreneurs, where young folks are killing themselves to find a billionaire to fund them. Almost none of them will succeed, but they're motivated by the image of a tiny number of rare successes. The world is full of young people giving 150% effort for paltry returns on their time investment all to enrich entrenched oligarchs/oligopolies. Youtube isn't the worst, it isn't an outlier, and there are far more important and dangerous systems than youtube.
radeklew 7y ago
Off the top of my head, James Charles lost a million subscribers before people changed their mind about whose side they were on. Toby Turner had rape allegations made against him which were later taken back. It's hard to say where his channel would be had that not happened, but the timing makes it seem like it was a major factor in its decline.

JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago

My comment is about the financial risks in being a YouTube star: there's a risk you lose your income abruptly, but I suppose you could be fired from a normal job. Companies go under; CEOs get canned. I promise, my intent was not political. I do, however, feel the risks are higher in YouTube because what you say is more subject to public scrutiny. Your colleagues aren't going to advocate for your removal at work for what you say outside of work hours around your friends in a social setting. But when you're a public figure, or representing brands in videos, even those little moments become subject to criticism. YouTube stars' lives blend professional and personal spheres in ways that ordinary careers do not.

criley2 7y ago
So, to be clear, you cannot think of a single youtuber who was "cancelled" unjustly, despite writing a statement which implied that most of the cases were unjust as a rule? To be frank, this is exactly what I thought, and really calls into question why you would make such a biased and baseless comment. Your criticism appears to have nothing to do with youtube at all, and is a general criticism of public life and how being a public figure opens you up to greater scrutiny both from the platforms you use publicly as well as the audiences you reach. Which, while true, is a truism that is far older than the internet... or electricity... or democracy...
- JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
  The difference between other public figures, such as politicians, presidents, and movie stars is they make millions of dollars per year. YouTube stars usually don't. They're putting all of the time and little money they have into something so fragile, so easily broken. PewDiePie mentions this in his video about taking a break: He did not expect a YouTube career to be a possible, long-sustaining venture. He expected, maybe 1-2 years of success and then it'd fizzle out, though that's not what happened. This paragraph is my criticism specifically with YouTube. It enabled lower and middle class people, who don't have the financial security to handle the realities of life as a public figure, to become public figures. Why do you need me to name a person impacted by cancel culture? The discussion shouldn't latch onto one person's particular situation. I have enough empathy in me to believe that some people impacted by cancel culture regret their actions, and are given no opportunity to make amends, and I think that's toxic and it encourages people to be further more toxic, because they're given no other option than to double down. Cancel culture is a very new phenomena and is not as old as electricity or democracy.
  - hsod 7y ago
    > Why do you need me to name a person impacted by cancel culture? The discussion shouldn't latch onto one person's particular situation. I have enough empathy in me to believe that some people impacted by cancel culture regret their actions, and are given no opportunity to make amends, and I think that's toxic and it encourages people to be further more toxic, because they're given no other option than to double down. Cancel culture is a very new phenomena and is not as old as electricity or democracy. I think the issue here is that you haven't given any clear explanation of what you believe "cancel culture" to be, and seem unwilling or unable to give a single example of it. Without an example or at least a clear explanation, it's hard to evaluate your concerns about people "given no opportunity to make amends". For instance, I recall pewdiepie said the N word on stream and got some backlash, apologized, and moved on with his very popular channel. Is that cancel culture?
  - criley2 7y ago
    "Why do you need me to name a person impacted by cancel culture? Because you lied to push a biased and false political narrative, and when challenged, you admitted it. I wanted you to substantiate your beliefs because I knew you had fallen for bad propaganda, and I hoped that by demanding evidence, you would re-evaluate your biased position, realize it was not founded on reality or evidence, and grow as a person. I hoped in some small way to cure this propaganda infection, and inoculate you against future attacks on your concept of reality. Obviously, that failed. P.S. if you think everyone in the public is millionaires only, you live an extremely ignorant or privileged life. Almost none of the politicians, news reporters, actors on television, athletes are millionaires. It's very rare to be a millionaire and only the top of the top are. The vast majority of everyone you see on television or read on the internet are not a millionaires. If you think Youtube is a grinder, check out College Football and the NFL. See how many kids give their bodies, their health, their lives and only 1/1000 even make it, and of that number, generally only 1/100 will sign a major million+ contract. Want another example? Check out YCombinator, the culture of over-work, hackers, start-ups, entrepreneurs, where young folks are killing themselves to find a billionaire to fund them. Almost none of them will succeed, but they're motivated by the image of a tiny number of rare successes. The world is full of young people giving 150% effort for paltry returns on their time investment all to enrich entrenched oligarchs/oligopolies. Youtube isn't the worst, it isn't an outlier, and there are far more important and dangerous systems than youtube.

radeklew 7y ago

Off the top of my head, James Charles lost a million subscribers before people changed their mind about whose side they were on. Toby Turner had rape allegations made against him which were later taken back. It's hard to say where his channel would be had that not happened, but the timing makes it seem like it was a major factor in its decline.