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>Unions are often rent-seeking monopolies. And so are corporations. Unions at least have the interest of employees as their central (espoused) tenant. There is

>Unions are often rent-seeking monopolies. And so are corporations. Unions at least have the interest of employees as their central (espoused) tenant. There is and always has been a concerted effort between capital and the media to undermine that fact in the mind of the public. This is a huge contributing factor to the falling bargaining power of labor over the last 50 years. Don't fall for it.

aianus 7y ago
Don't condescend to me. The only bargaining power is the ability to switch jobs easily -- something unions specifically fight against.
- lotsofpulp 7y ago
  A seller gains bargaining power by increasing the number of buyers, and/or decreasing the number of sellers. Therefore, there is an increase in bargaining power by unionizing, since it reduces the number of sellers.
- pnutjam 7y ago
  For an educated and specialized workforce, changing employers can result in huge wage gains, I know, I've benefited from this too. However, much of this is due to the present economy and who knows how long it will last. For an average worker, the path to higher wages is through seniority and institutional knowledge that makes them more valuable. When they change jobs, they are often right back at the bottom, union or no union. They are also competing against young, fresh workers.
pnutjam 7y ago
This morning I was thinking of Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle". If you've read it (and you should, it's a good novel) you know it's about worker rights and the story follows a guy who happens to work at a meat packing plant for awhile. If you haven't read it, you've probably been taught it is about the bad practices of food producers in that era. Nevermind that part is ancillary to the central story. Just pointing out that this warping of views to suit the wealthy has been going on a long time.
- bluGill 7y ago
  Note that the book is fiction. Reality was exaggerated to make is point. I'm not arguing it is a bad book, but it isn't real.
  - pnutjam 7y ago
    My comment is related to how the thrust of the social commentary was almost wholly diverted by (speculation on my part) moneyed interests.
AnimalMuppet 7y ago
> Unions at least have the interest of employees as their central (espoused) tenant. You know, if they actually lived that out, there would be a lot less union-bashing. It's not just a capitalist conspiracy to slander unions. It's also (and primarily) that, within my lifetime, unions have been better at protecting union bureaucracy than at protecting rank-and-file workers. They still have a role to play. I just wish they actually did what they're supposed to do. The workers need someone who's trying to help them instead of to exploit them. And unions are trying to help workers not be exploited by companies... while exploiting workers themselves.

aianus 7y ago

Don't condescend to me. The only bargaining power is the ability to switch jobs easily -- something unions specifically fight against.

lotsofpulp 7y ago
A seller gains bargaining power by increasing the number of buyers, and/or decreasing the number of sellers. Therefore, there is an increase in bargaining power by unionizing, since it reduces the number of sellers.
pnutjam 7y ago
For an educated and specialized workforce, changing employers can result in huge wage gains, I know, I've benefited from this too. However, much of this is due to the present economy and who knows how long it will last. For an average worker, the path to higher wages is through seniority and institutional knowledge that makes them more valuable. When they change jobs, they are often right back at the bottom, union or no union. They are also competing against young, fresh workers.

pnutjam 7y ago

This morning I was thinking of Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle". If you've read it (and you should, it's a good novel) you know it's about worker rights and the story follows a guy who happens to work at a meat packing plant for awhile. If you haven't read it, you've probably been taught it is about the bad practices of food producers in that era. Nevermind that part is ancillary to the central story. Just pointing out that this warping of views to suit the wealthy has been going on a long time.

bluGill 7y ago
Note that the book is fiction. Reality was exaggerated to make is point. I'm not arguing it is a bad book, but it isn't real.
- pnutjam 7y ago
  My comment is related to how the thrust of the social commentary was almost wholly diverted by (speculation on my part) moneyed interests.

AnimalMuppet 7y ago

> Unions at least have the interest of employees as their central (espoused) tenant. You know, if they actually lived that out, there would be a lot less union-bashing. It's not just a capitalist conspiracy to slander unions. It's also (and primarily) that, within my lifetime, unions have been better at protecting union bureaucracy than at protecting rank-and-file workers. They still have a role to play. I just wish they actually did what they're supposed to do. The workers need someone who's trying to help them instead of to exploit them. And unions are trying to help workers not be exploited by companies... while exploiting workers themselves.