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One thing that is a bit misleading in this article is the part that says members are asked to pay tithing even if they can't pay things like utilities and food.

by jjeaff 7y ago

One thing that is a bit misleading in this article is the part that says members are asked to pay tithing even if they can't pay things like utilities and food. Many members take great pride in paying their tithing first, no matter what. What this article left out was that no tithe paying member would ever be allowed to have their power shut off or not have food or other important necessities. The church has and will provide food and even pay important bills for members if they need it. I have worked in bookkeeping at our local Ward and personally seen large checks for mortgage parents, electric bills, and even medical bills for needy members or members that were otherwise just going through a financial rough spot. I should also add that this aid is not predicated on paying tithing or not. But local leadership does have to make decisions about whether the request for help is sincere and I would imagine being a faithful tithe paying member makes you more likely to receive help. As for the rest of the article, I think there are definitely some transparency issues and maybe even some misleading statements from some leaders about how tithe money is used. But I don't think anyone was led to believe that the church is spending most of what is taken in. The church has always had grand expansion plans. I would expect any organization with such plans to stockpile a war chest.

Scaevolus 7y ago
Based on the fact that they have a $100B tax-exempt warchest, the payout ratio of that social safety net is pretty low.
- jjeaff 7y ago
  It's not even the same funds. I was merely pointing out that it isn't true that poor members are lacking basic necessities while being pressured to pay tithing.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - perseusmandate 7y ago
    You're right, you aren't "forced" to pay, you're merely deprived of the right to participate in temple rituals that are central to the community and teachings if you don't. And also have to tell your bishop, the most important and powerful member of your local community that you aren't going to pay in a private 1:1 meeting.
    - colejohnson66 7y ago
      Even if you tell your Bishop, he’s not gonna care. It’s not his job. Yes, there are bad Bishops, but you can always move up the “chain of command” to your Stake President if the Bishop does something you don’t like.
    - jjeaff 7y ago
      You don't have to tell your Bishop anything. The Bishop doesn't check the amount that you paid and if you wanted extra privacy, you can pay tithing directly to church headquarters. IF you choose to setup an interview with the Bishop, they will ask you if you are "a full tithe payer". Up to you to be truthful or not.
supercanuck 7y ago
Sure. Clearly the portfolio adviser, who used his name no less and did not stay anonymous, doesn't have as much visibility to their charitable works managing a 100B portfolio as say you do bookkeeping for your local ward.
- jjeaff 7y ago
  I wasn't taking issue with the apparent $100B in assets that are being held on to rather than spent. Merely stating something that essentially every Mormon knows and can be easily verified but was left out. It's not really a pertinent fact to this issue of a huge investment fund. Except for the apparent editorial by the reporter that members are asked to pay tithing even when they can't afford it, which is misleading.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - supercanuck 7y ago
    You leave a lot of details out. One does not just “not tithe” if they are poor in the Mormon religion.
perseusmandate 7y ago
I've heard many times in the church that you're supposed to pay tithing even if you can't afford it and that "blessings" (often material) will make up the difference. It is patently dangerous financial advice. The amount of welfare the church distributes via the bishop's storehouse is paltry compared to their overall holdings. It would also be extremely embarrassing to have to go to the leadership in your community and ask them to support you You don't have to pay tithing to get access to the financial support of the church but you do in order to get a temple recommend and thus participate in basic and fundamental activities such as attending the marriage of a loved one, do all the temple work they always tell you to etc

by jjeaff 7y ago

Scaevolus 7y ago

Based on the fact that they have a $100B tax-exempt warchest, the payout ratio of that social safety net is pretty low.

jjeaff 7y ago
It's not even the same funds. I was merely pointing out that it isn't true that poor members are lacking basic necessities while being pressured to pay tithing.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- perseusmandate 7y ago
  You're right, you aren't "forced" to pay, you're merely deprived of the right to participate in temple rituals that are central to the community and teachings if you don't. And also have to tell your bishop, the most important and powerful member of your local community that you aren't going to pay in a private 1:1 meeting.
  - colejohnson66 7y ago
    Even if you tell your Bishop, he’s not gonna care. It’s not his job. Yes, there are bad Bishops, but you can always move up the “chain of command” to your Stake President if the Bishop does something you don’t like.
  - jjeaff 7y ago
    You don't have to tell your Bishop anything. The Bishop doesn't check the amount that you paid and if you wanted extra privacy, you can pay tithing directly to church headquarters. IF you choose to setup an interview with the Bishop, they will ask you if you are "a full tithe payer". Up to you to be truthful or not.

supercanuck 7y ago

Sure. Clearly the portfolio adviser, who used his name no less and did not stay anonymous, doesn't have as much visibility to their charitable works managing a 100B portfolio as say you do bookkeeping for your local ward.

jjeaff 7y ago
I wasn't taking issue with the apparent $100B in assets that are being held on to rather than spent. Merely stating something that essentially every Mormon knows and can be easily verified but was left out. It's not really a pertinent fact to this issue of a huge investment fund. Except for the apparent editorial by the reporter that members are asked to pay tithing even when they can't afford it, which is misleading.
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- supercanuck 7y ago
  You leave a lot of details out. One does not just “not tithe” if they are poor in the Mormon religion.

perseusmandate 7y ago

I've heard many times in the church that you're supposed to pay tithing even if you can't afford it and that "blessings" (often material) will make up the difference. It is patently dangerous financial advice. The amount of welfare the church distributes via the bishop's storehouse is paltry compared to their overall holdings. It would also be extremely embarrassing to have to go to the leadership in your community and ask them to support you You don't have to pay tithing to get access to the financial support of the church but you do in order to get a temple recommend and thus participate in basic and fundamental activities such as attending the marriage of a loved one, do all the temple work they always tell you to etc