4 ms·

"Unsafe despite software patch" - the modern day Corvair. I'll never fly on one of these, and neither should you. Boeing needs to get their act together...

AmVess 7y ago
The only way for that to happen is to purge the entire executive suite. Will that happen? No, thus a new(ish) and now chronic distrust of the company and the decision that it makes.
- fallous 7y ago
  If it were merely the executives that made the fatal decisions regarding the 737 MAX then clearing out the top level of management may suffice, but it's fairly clear that it wasn't a C-level decision in this case. Once you have a bad culture established in an organization it's very hard to turn that around absent a rather drastic purging of employees at multiple levels combined with a very pro-active new management that not only talks about the necessary new culture but also actively implements the incentives required to enforce such a culture. Personally I've had to deal with cultural turn around efforts at companies in the past (albeit nowhere near the scale of Boeing) and over time I learned that the only reliable way to address such a situation is to purge with fire and bring in new people.
  - BOOSTERHIDROGEN 7y ago
    interesting situation, like in ben horowitz new book, you have to have a shock culture to changed.
TylerE 7y ago
There was never really anything wrong with the Corvair.
- andbberger 7y ago
  Are we thinking of the same plane? The one with the square windows that caused stress fractures?
  - tzs 7y ago
    That was the de Havilland DH 106 Comet. He is talking about the Chevrolet Corviar, which was a car and the subject of Ralph Nader’s book Unsafe At Any Speed.
  - fallous 7y ago
    The Corvair was a GM automobile, made infamous by Ralph Nader's book "Unsafe at Any Speed." You're thinking of the de Havilland Comet (or possibly the aircraft manufacturer Convair).
    - andbberger 7y ago
      Hah!! Not even close. Thanks.
      - masonic 7y ago
        Airworthiness of the Corvair was also suspect.
- AnimalMuppet 7y ago
  Um... all those tuck-under accidents didn't happen? They weren't actually tuck under? They were tuck under, but that wasn't the fault of the car? What are you actually claiming here? And, can you document it rather than just claim it?
  - kalleboo 7y ago
    He's probably referring to the 1972 NHTSA report that basically says "well lots of other cars are just as unsafe, so it's fine".
fallous 7y ago
The Corvair was actually made safe at the end of the first generation and throughout the second generation rear suspension. The snap understeer of the 1960-1963 models wasn't especially unsafe, especially in relation to numerous Porsche 911 models that were released during and after the Corvair. GM's choice to recommend lower inflation pressures for the tires vs installing an anti-sway bar for the first gen cars with swing axle rear suspension (2nd gen was IRS) was rather stupid but it's nothing compared to the 737 MAX.

AmVess 7y ago

The only way for that to happen is to purge the entire executive suite. Will that happen? No, thus a new(ish) and now chronic distrust of the company and the decision that it makes.

fallous 7y ago
If it were merely the executives that made the fatal decisions regarding the 737 MAX then clearing out the top level of management may suffice, but it's fairly clear that it wasn't a C-level decision in this case. Once you have a bad culture established in an organization it's very hard to turn that around absent a rather drastic purging of employees at multiple levels combined with a very pro-active new management that not only talks about the necessary new culture but also actively implements the incentives required to enforce such a culture. Personally I've had to deal with cultural turn around efforts at companies in the past (albeit nowhere near the scale of Boeing) and over time I learned that the only reliable way to address such a situation is to purge with fire and bring in new people.
- BOOSTERHIDROGEN 7y ago
  interesting situation, like in ben horowitz new book, you have to have a shock culture to changed.

TylerE 7y ago

There was never really anything wrong with the Corvair.

andbberger 7y ago
Are we thinking of the same plane? The one with the square windows that caused stress fractures?
- tzs 7y ago
  That was the de Havilland DH 106 Comet. He is talking about the Chevrolet Corviar, which was a car and the subject of Ralph Nader’s book Unsafe At Any Speed.
- fallous 7y ago
  The Corvair was a GM automobile, made infamous by Ralph Nader's book "Unsafe at Any Speed." You're thinking of the de Havilland Comet (or possibly the aircraft manufacturer Convair).
  - andbberger 7y ago
    Hah!! Not even close. Thanks.
    - masonic 7y ago
      Airworthiness of the Corvair was also suspect.
AnimalMuppet 7y ago
Um... all those tuck-under accidents didn't happen? They weren't actually tuck under? They were tuck under, but that wasn't the fault of the car? What are you actually claiming here? And, can you document it rather than just claim it?
- kalleboo 7y ago
  He's probably referring to the 1972 NHTSA report that basically says "well lots of other cars are just as unsafe, so it's fine".

fallous 7y ago

The Corvair was actually made safe at the end of the first generation and throughout the second generation rear suspension. The snap understeer of the 1960-1963 models wasn't especially unsafe, especially in relation to numerous Porsche 911 models that were released during and after the Corvair. GM's choice to recommend lower inflation pressures for the tires vs installing an anti-sway bar for the first gen cars with swing axle rear suspension (2nd gen was IRS) was rather stupid but it's nothing compared to the 737 MAX.