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Umm, the entire system is propaganda. The president has a bully pulpit and that drives the news. Meanwhile, from your selective editing (nice bit of propaganda

by robg 18y ago

Umm, the entire system is propaganda. The president has a bully pulpit and that drives the news. Meanwhile, from your selective editing (nice bit of propaganda, yourself!) Russert is asking the exact questions that needed to be asked at that time. Still, no journalist was going to be able to dispute a deceptive administration on the WMDs. Their only hope was to question the evidence. And Russert did exactly that. What did you want from him? To call Cheney a liar to his face? Based on what? As it is, he was incredulous at the aluminum tubes.

LPTS 18y ago
My edits crossed your post. I pointed out the parts that are clearly propaganda techniques. It isn't propaganda for me to quote him like this. I just located the examples of subtle propaganda. See, the entire system isn't supposed to be propaganda. Thats why we have a first amendment. To prevent exactly that. It's not a defense of Tim. Russert pretended to question them to help Dick Cheney lay out his case. That's his role. This is not actual questioning. That's the message control his press person testified about Russert giving. Look at the subtle linguistic structure of what he's saying. Propaganda. I wanted him to not ask questions that subtly presuppose the exact things Dick Cheney is trying to deceive the ameriacn people into believing. I wanted him not to work off the record with Cheney's press people before the interviews. I wanted him to tell us when a powerful corrupt person slips instead of later taking it off the record (this is not about the live interviews, but the stuff on background and stuff like that).
- robg 18y ago
  How could you possibly know he was "pretending"? I suppose he was faking the incredulity at the aluminum tubes too? Journalists cover the news. They don't make it. Unfortunately, the system is unable to ferret out truth, no matter how much you'd like to believe otherwise. We were failed by a good many journalists who failed to ask the right questions. Russert wasn't one of them. The transcript shows exactly that. Better, what's one question he didn't ask that he should have in that interview? Name one.
  - LPTS 18y ago
    If people are debating whether or not Hussein is obtaining aluminum tubes for his WMDs (the ones he has "too") the propagandist wins. When Russert postures like this, he's miming the false dichotomy the propagandist wants people to be arguing. The question being debated covertly contains the information the propagandist wants to convey (the propagandist doesn't care about the thing being debated). In this way, the fact the propagandist wants to convey sinks into both sides of the superficial argument. Russert's skepticism of these tubes is a textbook example of this mode of propaganda. "Hussein has the tubes for his WMD program." "There is no evidence he has tubes for his WMD program." People here "WMD program" 20 times. Who cares about the tubes, that's where the propaganda is working. I don't think he was evil. I think he got in over his head and then was so interested in keeping his power and access he let himself be available to be manipulated. I would of wanted him to ask about the way Cheney's press office handled the run up to the interview, and what he knew about the way his press office was setting up his interviews.
    - robg 18y ago
      "I would of wanted him to ask about the way Cheney's press office handled the run up to the interview, and what he knew about the way his press office was setting up his interviews." Wow, that would have been insightful. Meanwhile, you're naive if you think the President (and VP) doesn't set the national agenda. The problem is not enough journalists questioned that agenda. Russert wasn't one of them. Russert asked the questions. That's more than 99% of the journalists did at the same time. I simply don't see how you can blame him because the answers were deceptive. He was never going to be in a position to prove the administration wrong (nor any journalist).
      - LPTS 18y ago
        We crossed edits again. I don't think the presidents prerogative to set the agenda extends to colluding with a supposedly free press to deceive the american public. The way Russert questioned the VP was part of that collusion. (Hey, I noticed you're a neuroscientist. If we're going to be typing back and forth, I'd rather be picking your brain about that then spending one more second of my life thinking about Tim Russert.)

by robg 18y ago

LPTS 18y ago

My edits crossed your post. I pointed out the parts that are clearly propaganda techniques. It isn't propaganda for me to quote him like this. I just located the examples of subtle propaganda. See, the entire system isn't supposed to be propaganda. Thats why we have a first amendment. To prevent exactly that. It's not a defense of Tim. Russert pretended to question them to help Dick Cheney lay out his case. That's his role. This is not actual questioning. That's the message control his press person testified about Russert giving. Look at the subtle linguistic structure of what he's saying. Propaganda. I wanted him to not ask questions that subtly presuppose the exact things Dick Cheney is trying to deceive the ameriacn people into believing. I wanted him not to work off the record with Cheney's press people before the interviews. I wanted him to tell us when a powerful corrupt person slips instead of later taking it off the record (this is not about the live interviews, but the stuff on background and stuff like that).

robg 18y ago
How could you possibly know he was "pretending"? I suppose he was faking the incredulity at the aluminum tubes too? Journalists cover the news. They don't make it. Unfortunately, the system is unable to ferret out truth, no matter how much you'd like to believe otherwise. We were failed by a good many journalists who failed to ask the right questions. Russert wasn't one of them. The transcript shows exactly that. Better, what's one question he didn't ask that he should have in that interview? Name one.
- LPTS 18y ago
  If people are debating whether or not Hussein is obtaining aluminum tubes for his WMDs (the ones he has "too") the propagandist wins. When Russert postures like this, he's miming the false dichotomy the propagandist wants people to be arguing. The question being debated covertly contains the information the propagandist wants to convey (the propagandist doesn't care about the thing being debated). In this way, the fact the propagandist wants to convey sinks into both sides of the superficial argument. Russert's skepticism of these tubes is a textbook example of this mode of propaganda. "Hussein has the tubes for his WMD program." "There is no evidence he has tubes for his WMD program." People here "WMD program" 20 times. Who cares about the tubes, that's where the propaganda is working. I don't think he was evil. I think he got in over his head and then was so interested in keeping his power and access he let himself be available to be manipulated. I would of wanted him to ask about the way Cheney's press office handled the run up to the interview, and what he knew about the way his press office was setting up his interviews.
  - robg 18y ago
    "I would of wanted him to ask about the way Cheney's press office handled the run up to the interview, and what he knew about the way his press office was setting up his interviews." Wow, that would have been insightful. Meanwhile, you're naive if you think the President (and VP) doesn't set the national agenda. The problem is not enough journalists questioned that agenda. Russert wasn't one of them. Russert asked the questions. That's more than 99% of the journalists did at the same time. I simply don't see how you can blame him because the answers were deceptive. He was never going to be in a position to prove the administration wrong (nor any journalist).
    - LPTS 18y ago
      We crossed edits again. I don't think the presidents prerogative to set the agenda extends to colluding with a supposedly free press to deceive the american public. The way Russert questioned the VP was part of that collusion. (Hey, I noticed you're a neuroscientist. If we're going to be typing back and forth, I'd rather be picking your brain about that then spending one more second of my life thinking about Tim Russert.)