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Actually the butter is the important thing in this article. The self-driving revolution isn't going to enable beautiful and wondrous accomplishments. Instead,

Actually the butter is the important thing in this article. The self-driving revolution isn't going to enable beautiful and wondrous accomplishments. Instead, it's going to enable international megaconglomerates to more cheaply exploit the desperately poor migrant workforces of far-away places. That's all you're going to get out if it: butter at the same price, but from Tulare County and the butter company saves ten cents per ton by cutting out the trucker.

asdfasgasdgasdg 7y ago
I have trouble believing you actually think that. I suspect you are just trying to defend a comment that's indefensibly vapid. But, if you genuinely believe there's no positive value in freight and that making it more efficient is an unworthy goal, then I don't think we'll come eye to eye on anything tonight.
jelliclesfarm 7y ago
Why isn’t this a great accomplishment? People don’t have to be long haul truck drivers or be alert the whole time.. Even if it entirely eliminates human beings, it means the person who’d be driving the truck will be able to do better paying or other fulfilling tasks. Who knows...study or become an artist or spend more time with children etc. I also don’t see how migrant workers are being exploited? How is anyone exploited if they are not driving long haul truck routes?
- bsder 7y ago
  > I also don’t see how migrant workers are being exploited? How is anyone exploited if they are not driving long haul truck routes? Because you are making it cheaper to transport from California agribusinesses who are known for violating labor laws to Pennsylvania who is known for enforcing labor laws. This is in opposition to local manufacturing which becomes more economically feasible the more transport costs.
  - jelliclesfarm 7y ago
    Can you share your source for the above statements re ca agribusinesses violating labor laws etc. Thanks.
    - bsder 7y ago
      Okay, I'll play along even though the most cursory Google search has tons of hits: "Verify: Are half of California farmworkers undocumented?" https://www.abc10.com/article/news/local/verify/verify-are-half-of-california-farmworkers-undocumented/464768839 https://www.abc10.com/article/news/local/verify/verify-are-h... Deporting illegal workers is causing farm workers to finally be above minimum wage: "Wages rise on California farms. Americans still don’t want the job" https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-farms-immigration/ https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-farms-immigration/ I chose those two articles because they are quite a bit more "pro-immigration" than others and most likely to blunt the knee-jerk "Yer a raciiiiist!" idiots. The real problem is that rather than deporting all these people we should be hitting the agribusinesses with gigantic fines and jail time for exploiting them in the first place. If some CEOs wound up in jail for employing undocumented workers and not paying minimum wage instead of just getting a slap on the wrist, this problem would self-correct.
- deeblering4 7y ago
  I take it you are not a trucker who is providing for a family. Think about not only losing your job but losing your entire industry.
  - jelliclesfarm 7y ago
    Are you a trucker? Once upon a time, horse drawn carriages transported people and there were stables and groomsmen and carriage drivers and those who provided food and board for the horses. That entire industry and those jobs disappeared when the motor cars came along. They found other jobs. We moved on.
    - crtlaltdel 7y ago
      ^ this is a great comment, and speaks to the reality. as cars came to prominence a whole host of supporting industry developed, creating jobs. it seems like some of those jobs required more technical training than the jobs they replaced.
    - deeblering4 7y ago
      Yeah, and once dinosaurs roamed the earth. It’s easy to make generalizations about the merits of moving on when you aren’t being left behind.
      - jelliclesfarm 7y ago
        Yes. This is true..what you say. But the world keeps turning. C’est la vie etc.
  - nwallin 7y ago
    A bar friend of mine is currently a truck driver. He's going to school to learn to be a network engineer. Retraining is a really important part of our modern reality. The idea that we can simply turn off the tap of advancing technology so that the hardest working, lowest paid workers can continue to toil for peanuts is super shitty. There are some incredibly intelligent people who stumbled in their development who really deserve a second chance at jobs that aren't ass.
throwaway1931 7y ago
When my family immigrated to this country I was told I was here to take "their jobs". I started by taking an engineering job but I'm only one person that's not good enough, so I automated everyone around me out of a job... but I could do better. Make AI that does people's jobs and I the immigrant can take a lot more people's jobs.
- aiphex 7y ago
  You're a bitter guy or what? I'm sorry you were treated that way, but you know there are good people out there.

asdfasgasdgasdg 7y ago

I have trouble believing you actually think that. I suspect you are just trying to defend a comment that's indefensibly vapid. But, if you genuinely believe there's no positive value in freight and that making it more efficient is an unworthy goal, then I don't think we'll come eye to eye on anything tonight.

jelliclesfarm 7y ago

Why isn’t this a great accomplishment? People don’t have to be long haul truck drivers or be alert the whole time.. Even if it entirely eliminates human beings, it means the person who’d be driving the truck will be able to do better paying or other fulfilling tasks. Who knows...study or become an artist or spend more time with children etc. I also don’t see how migrant workers are being exploited? How is anyone exploited if they are not driving long haul truck routes?

bsder 7y ago
> I also don’t see how migrant workers are being exploited? How is anyone exploited if they are not driving long haul truck routes? Because you are making it cheaper to transport from California agribusinesses who are known for violating labor laws to Pennsylvania who is known for enforcing labor laws. This is in opposition to local manufacturing which becomes more economically feasible the more transport costs.
- jelliclesfarm 7y ago
  Can you share your source for the above statements re ca agribusinesses violating labor laws etc. Thanks.
  - bsder 7y ago
    Okay, I'll play along even though the most cursory Google search has tons of hits: "Verify: Are half of California farmworkers undocumented?" https://www.abc10.com/article/news/local/verify/verify-are-half-of-california-farmworkers-undocumented/464768839 https://www.abc10.com/article/news/local/verify/verify-are-h... Deporting illegal workers is causing farm workers to finally be above minimum wage: "Wages rise on California farms. Americans still don’t want the job" https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-farms-immigration/ https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-farms-immigration/ I chose those two articles because they are quite a bit more "pro-immigration" than others and most likely to blunt the knee-jerk "Yer a raciiiiist!" idiots. The real problem is that rather than deporting all these people we should be hitting the agribusinesses with gigantic fines and jail time for exploiting them in the first place. If some CEOs wound up in jail for employing undocumented workers and not paying minimum wage instead of just getting a slap on the wrist, this problem would self-correct.
deeblering4 7y ago
I take it you are not a trucker who is providing for a family. Think about not only losing your job but losing your entire industry.
- jelliclesfarm 7y ago
  Are you a trucker? Once upon a time, horse drawn carriages transported people and there were stables and groomsmen and carriage drivers and those who provided food and board for the horses. That entire industry and those jobs disappeared when the motor cars came along. They found other jobs. We moved on.
  - crtlaltdel 7y ago
    ^ this is a great comment, and speaks to the reality. as cars came to prominence a whole host of supporting industry developed, creating jobs. it seems like some of those jobs required more technical training than the jobs they replaced.
  - deeblering4 7y ago
    Yeah, and once dinosaurs roamed the earth. It’s easy to make generalizations about the merits of moving on when you aren’t being left behind.
    - jelliclesfarm 7y ago
      Yes. This is true..what you say. But the world keeps turning. C’est la vie etc.
- nwallin 7y ago
  A bar friend of mine is currently a truck driver. He's going to school to learn to be a network engineer. Retraining is a really important part of our modern reality. The idea that we can simply turn off the tap of advancing technology so that the hardest working, lowest paid workers can continue to toil for peanuts is super shitty. There are some incredibly intelligent people who stumbled in their development who really deserve a second chance at jobs that aren't ass.

throwaway1931 7y ago

When my family immigrated to this country I was told I was here to take "their jobs". I started by taking an engineering job but I'm only one person that's not good enough, so I automated everyone around me out of a job... but I could do better. Make AI that does people's jobs and I the immigrant can take a lot more people's jobs.

aiphex 7y ago
You're a bitter guy or what? I'm sorry you were treated that way, but you know there are good people out there.