3 ms·

>they’ve been convinced to tie up their entire identity in being one of the lucky 10%3 that lands a tenure-track research job, For context, this is a philosoph

by scythe 7y ago

>they’ve been convinced to tie up their entire identity in being one of the lucky 10%3 that lands a tenure-track research job, For context, this is a philosophy program! STEM PhDs have a good enough job outlook that I don’t need to explain it. Humanities like sociology and history can often be parleyed into a career in social work, politics or law. This isn’t always the best career path, but it’s still a good bet for being the most interesting. But philosophy is unique. It’s supposed to be central; philosophy is that field which justifies itself while work in other fields is demanded by some external force. Philosophy is humanity’s attempt to say things which are not contingent on other things, assuming that’s even possible. So who could possibly tell a philosophy PhD that they’re on the wrong track? Shouldn’t philosophy, itself, provide that argument? And shouldn’t dealing with the questions of life itself, at the highest level, be at least a little stressful? Wouldn’t it be a little strange if becoming a philosopher follows a generally unremarkable educational trajectory?

pmiller2 7y ago
10% is pretty low, but, even in math (the only field I really know anything about), only about 1/3 will end up with a tenure track position.
HelloSalt 7y ago
Unfortunately that is not true, and I speak from experience. 4 years doing a physics PhD in the UK, almost all my experiments failed (in the building managers cranked up the heating/air con so the temperature was fluctuating +-5 degrees throughout the day and all carefully aligned optical components couldn't be kept aligned, etc way rather than the expected effect is weak), 30 mins with a supervisor once every other month, only person in group other than supervisor, etc. Physics is definitely STEM, and I found it horrendous to find a job after graduating. It took in excess to 500 tailored applications and 6 months to get anything at all. I was only a few weeks away from depending on welfare to avoid homelessness when I finally got an interview. STEM skills shortage is an outright lie, all I see is an entire order of magnitude oversupply for STEM educated people. Overall Grad School is an absolutely horrible experience, and I would completely defund public purse support of any university that engages in PhD "research" or "teaching" if it were in my power to do so.
- scythe 7y ago
  > I found it horrendous to find a job after graduating. It took in excess to 500 tailored applications and 6 months to get anything at all. Honestly, six months isn't that long. I've spent that long looking for a job. But I found one. And furthermore, getting a job in physics at all is the whole point of grad school. If that isn't a success condition for you, of course you shouldn't go to grad school. If you want money, be a chemical engineer or write software. And this doesn't make you look good: >4 years doing a physics PhD in the UK, almost all my experiments failed (in the building managers cranked up the heating/air con so the temperature was fluctuating +-5 degrees throughout the day and all carefully aligned optical components couldn't be kept aligned, etc way rather than the expected effect is weak), 30 mins with a supervisor once every other month, only person in group other than supervisor, etc. I've been in two grad programs and had close experience with another three. Grad school is supposed to be self-directed. Unfortunately a lot of students show up with no communication skills and aren't helped in building them. But you can't self-direct without communicating. Especially not in science. And everything about this paragraph points to a lack of effective and timely communication from your end. No contact with advisor? Advisor is busier than you are. You email first. Building manager stupid? Tell them off. No others in group? Email someone at another university. No response? Try someone else. You sit in a room and work alone, you lose. Those are all things I wish I had done when I was in a PhD program, of course.

by scythe 7y ago

pmiller2 7y ago

10% is pretty low, but, even in math (the only field I really know anything about), only about 1/3 will end up with a tenure track position.

HelloSalt 7y ago

Unfortunately that is not true, and I speak from experience. 4 years doing a physics PhD in the UK, almost all my experiments failed (in the building managers cranked up the heating/air con so the temperature was fluctuating +-5 degrees throughout the day and all carefully aligned optical components couldn't be kept aligned, etc way rather than the expected effect is weak), 30 mins with a supervisor once every other month, only person in group other than supervisor, etc. Physics is definitely STEM, and I found it horrendous to find a job after graduating. It took in excess to 500 tailored applications and 6 months to get anything at all. I was only a few weeks away from depending on welfare to avoid homelessness when I finally got an interview. STEM skills shortage is an outright lie, all I see is an entire order of magnitude oversupply for STEM educated people. Overall Grad School is an absolutely horrible experience, and I would completely defund public purse support of any university that engages in PhD "research" or "teaching" if it were in my power to do so.

scythe 7y ago
> I found it horrendous to find a job after graduating. It took in excess to 500 tailored applications and 6 months to get anything at all. Honestly, six months isn't that long. I've spent that long looking for a job. But I found one. And furthermore, getting a job in physics at all is the whole point of grad school. If that isn't a success condition for you, of course you shouldn't go to grad school. If you want money, be a chemical engineer or write software. And this doesn't make you look good: >4 years doing a physics PhD in the UK, almost all my experiments failed (in the building managers cranked up the heating/air con so the temperature was fluctuating +-5 degrees throughout the day and all carefully aligned optical components couldn't be kept aligned, etc way rather than the expected effect is weak), 30 mins with a supervisor once every other month, only person in group other than supervisor, etc. I've been in two grad programs and had close experience with another three. Grad school is supposed to be self-directed. Unfortunately a lot of students show up with no communication skills and aren't helped in building them. But you can't self-direct without communicating. Especially not in science. And everything about this paragraph points to a lack of effective and timely communication from your end. No contact with advisor? Advisor is busier than you are. You email first. Building manager stupid? Tell them off. No others in group? Email someone at another university. No response? Try someone else. You sit in a room and work alone, you lose. Those are all things I wish I had done when I was in a PhD program, of course.