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I think you’re being overly picky and cherry-picking your argument here. I don’t know anyone who thinks that child rearing is not hard work, and all agree that

by orev 7y ago

I think you’re being overly picky and cherry-picking your argument here. I don’t know anyone who thinks that child rearing is not hard work, and all agree that it is valuable. But in the context of this discussion, “productivity” is an economic term for the production of goods or services, and the generation of income for the workers. Child rearing does neither of those things directly, so as an economic activity, it doesn’t register and thus those parents are not part of the workforce. Again, that does not mean it is not a valuable thing to do for both the child and society, but it also does not directly add to GDP, generate income taxes, etc.

cjmcqueen 7y ago
Child rearing produces children that are adults and had the attention of a fully invested parent. Are you sure you're measuring the right thing?
- tristanstcyr 7y ago
  The reality is that the atomic family model is antiquated. In our society, the individual is the unit We must therefore make the individual strong, meaning that we need to support both parents independent all the while having children. We can observe that the old model was better in terms of a certain metric, but that's not going to help. We need to invest in making child rearing effective in today's world.
  - jriot 7y ago
    The atomic family model is not antiquated. The majority of the country follows that model with research demonstrating that is the best path for success.
  - loco5niner 7y ago
    > In our society, the individual is the unit This is definitely the wrong mindset.
makomk 7y ago
It's funny you should mention GDP, because childcare is one of the iconic well-known examples of why it can be a misleading measure. If person A is paid to care for person B's kids whilst they work, that results in higher GDP than if person B cares for their own kids and person A takes the job instead, even though exactly the same amount is being done, because caring for those kids is no longer a service that counts towards GDP under the latter scenario.
- bonoboTP 7y ago
  Isn't that a much more general argument? Anytime I do some garden work myself, fix some appliance myself, clean my house, buy groceries, cook my own dinner, do my taxes alone, drive my car myself, etc, I'm not increasing the GDP, but I would be if I paid for the respective service. Also note how in your first scenario both people earn money, in the second scenario only A does (ending up with more than what B had in scenario 1).

by orev 7y ago

cjmcqueen 7y ago

Child rearing produces children that are adults and had the attention of a fully invested parent. Are you sure you're measuring the right thing?

tristanstcyr 7y ago
The reality is that the atomic family model is antiquated. In our society, the individual is the unit We must therefore make the individual strong, meaning that we need to support both parents independent all the while having children. We can observe that the old model was better in terms of a certain metric, but that's not going to help. We need to invest in making child rearing effective in today's world.
- jriot 7y ago
  The atomic family model is not antiquated. The majority of the country follows that model with research demonstrating that is the best path for success.
- loco5niner 7y ago
  > In our society, the individual is the unit This is definitely the wrong mindset.

makomk 7y ago

It's funny you should mention GDP, because childcare is one of the iconic well-known examples of why it can be a misleading measure. If person A is paid to care for person B's kids whilst they work, that results in higher GDP than if person B cares for their own kids and person A takes the job instead, even though exactly the same amount is being done, because caring for those kids is no longer a service that counts towards GDP under the latter scenario.

bonoboTP 7y ago
Isn't that a much more general argument? Anytime I do some garden work myself, fix some appliance myself, clean my house, buy groceries, cook my own dinner, do my taxes alone, drive my car myself, etc, I'm not increasing the GDP, but I would be if I paid for the respective service. Also note how in your first scenario both people earn money, in the second scenario only A does (ending up with more than what B had in scenario 1).