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actually quite affordable considering it's merino. not comparable to regular cotton shirts.
by pclark 7y ago
actually quite affordable considering it's merino. not comparable to regular cotton shirts.
- 0xffff2 7y agoMaybe it's affordable for merino, but I disagree that it's not comparable to regular cotton shirts. A shirt is a shirt.
- omnimus 7y agoI posted it elswhere. Cheap clothes are travesty payed by unhuman labour and environment. Most stuff should cost 10x more. Probably 30x if you want to make it last long and be ethical. (we you should)
- 0xffff2 7y agoHow do you arrive at those numbers? If clothes cost 10x what they do today but fabric costs didn't change, I'd most certainly be sewing nearly all my own clothes. Give that I'm a software engineer in the bay area, this strongly suggests to me that 10x is too high.
- jacobush 7y agoFabric is also way too cheap. https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/dyeing-textile-sector-water-risks-adidas https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/dyeing-text...
- omnimus 7y agoI closely know people working for some high end brands. It is common knowledge. A dirty secret. The worst part is most of them dont give a fuck. Its just money grabbing. Unfortunately you also have no chance of knowing if your 1500usd hoodie was made well or by kid payed 12usd week. Its hard to expect other outcome since many brands are regular startups with investors. There are few monopoly megacorps like LVMH and Kering that act much like Facebooks and Googles and just squeeze anything for their investors and demolish/buy competition.
- atombender 7y agoDo you consider Everlane [1] to be ethical? They're based on the premise that the workers — in countries like Vietnam and Sri Lanka [2] — should be fairly compensated, and they're completely transparent about how much of the retail price goes to the factories. And yet their clothes, which in my experience are of high quality, are not expensive; they're certainly not 10 times the cost of similar clothing from, say, Uniqlo, Zara or H&M. [1] https://everlane.com/ https://everlane.com/ [2] https://www.everlane.com/factories/ https://www.everlane.com/factories/
- omnimus 7y agoNever heard abou Everlane. Looks nice. The question is how do we know what they claim is true? There are some certificate authorities for example but i am not sure we have this stuff figured out as society.
- taylorlapeyre 7y agoI used to work there, I can confirm that they are legit about their standards. They visit their factories constantly.
- philipkglass 7y agoI'm old enough to remember when American t-shirts and jeans were largely made in the USA. I still have some of the t-shirts. They were more expensive but no where near 10x, much less 30x. For that matter, I still buy boots made in the USA and they're less than 2x over boots made in Vietnam.
- shantly 7y ago> For that matter, I still buy boots made in the USA and they're less than 2x over boots made in Vietnam. Same, if someone can point me to ultra-cheap leather shoes from the developing world that're anywhere near as good as the ones made in the US and Europe I'm absolutely mercenary enough to be all over that (aren't lower prices supposed to be the main way normal non-capitalists benefit from globalization, after all?). Savings seem to be at best ~40% vs. comparable products made by much more expensive OECD labor.
- omnimus 7y agoI said it in different comment yes i inflated it a bit but.. Made in USA is just part of it and it doesnt strictly mean it was ecological process. For example where was the cloth made? Coloring is where lot of the worst stuff happens. I don't really like sensationalist documentaries because it's never accurate but try "True Cost" or "River Blue".
- philipkglass 7y agoI believe that you are correct about the environmental damage done by producers in poorly-regulated countries. I believe that you are incorrect about how expensive it would be to do it cleanly instead. Dumping untreated wastewater back into the river will always be cheaper than treating it, but dye residues in particular are fairly easy to treat so that the waste water is again safe to drink. Dyeing enough denim for a pair of jeans with proper post-treatment for wastewater is only slightly more expensive than doing it by dumping the untreated wastewater. But if there are no laws or weak enforcement, a lot of companies (individuals for that matter) will behave destructively to save less than a dollar per unit.