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I recently listened to a podcast in which James Beshar interviews an anonymous San Francisco police officer who has been in the service for a long time. The pol

I recently listened to a podcast in which James Beshar interviews an anonymous San Francisco police officer who has been in the service for a long time. The police officer said that there are a lot of loopholes(not talking about paroles, probation or anything related) in California justice system in particular that allows felons to come out much faster than the actual time sentenced. For example felons that are sentenced for 30+ years in prison for committing serious crimes can come out in as fast as in 15 years by staying in certain prisons/jails that counts the time served as 2x or 3x. So lawyers game this so that the felons stay in these prisons/jails longer than other prisons and come out faster. I personally has not thought much about any of these issues and neither have a stand or expertise on what is right or wrong. I found what the police officer said (so did the host) very interesting and thought its worth sharing here. https://anchor.fm/belowtheline/episodes/37--Anonymous--San-Francisco-Police-Officer-e914q7 https://anchor.fm/belowtheline/episodes/37--Anonymous--San-F... Updated the comment for clarification.

hn_throwaway_99 7y ago
The article specifically stated the law would only apply to those felons no longer on parole or probation.
- vishnu_ks 7y ago
  I am not taking about Parole or Probation. Time sentenced in certain jails or prisons would be counted as 2x or 3x more the time served. So cases are often delayed by the lawyers so that felons stay in these jails longer and can come out early. The podcast has more details. I am myself not well versed with the exact terminology. Updated my original comment for clarity
NeedMoreTea 7y ago
What you call "loopholes" are thankfully a standard part of most justice systems, by design. It's called parole, sometimes released on licence. First you have to get past the parole board who will assess your suitability for release. The theory is to grant you supervised access back to society to regain your place in society. While on parole there's all sorts of reason you can find yourself back inside. Half or two thirds of sentence is pretty common too. What America does different is not having post sentence - that's post release and parole - rehabilitation, you are always an ex-felon, even after 50 years law abiding. Other nations find offenders can often reform and regain a place in society, particularly if given a fair chance...
- vishnu_ks 7y ago
  I am not taking about Parole or Probation. Time sentenced in certain jails or prisons would be counted as 2x or 3x more the time served. So cases are often delayed by the lawyers so that felons stay in these jails longer and can come out early. The podcast has more details. I am myself not well versed with the exact terminology. Updated my original comment for clarity.
  - gamblor956 7y ago
    I'm not going to reply to all of your follow-up comments, but it simply isn't possible to get 2x or 3x time served based on where you serve your sentence. The 2x time served is a good conduct credit equal to one day of conduct credit for every day served on good behavior. If you misbehave or commit further crimes in jail or prison, you don't get the credit. Violent felons get significantly less credit for good behavior (15%) and murderers aren't even eligible.
gamblor956 7y ago
The "anonymous officer" is misstating the way the rules actually work to the point of basically lying about them. (Actual rules: http://www.courts.ca.gov/partners/documents/CalculatingCustodyCredits.pdf http://www.courts.ca.gov/partners/documents/CalculatingCusto...) Custody credits. For crimes committed after October 2011, defendants who do not misbehave while in jail will receive 1 day of "conduct credits" for every 1 days of actual jail time served. Felons will similarly receive 1 day of conduct credit for every day of actual time served in prison while on good behavior. However, felons convicted of a violent crime only receive 15% conduct credit for time served (so 1 day of "conduct credit" for every 15 days of jail time served) and 0% credit if convicted of murder. The only crimes you can (or could) receive 30+ year sentences for in CA are violent crimes (like rape, armed robbery, or murder) or 3-strikes sentences, and such sentencing is no longer possible for a 3rd strike unless the 3rd strike is a violent crime. So lawyers game this so that the felons stay in these prisons/jails longer than other prisons and come out faster. The police officer is lying. Credits are based on statutory formulas and no facility provides any more custody credits than any other, because the facility doesn't determine how many credits you get.
- vishnu_ks 7y ago
  Can you listen to the podcast from 12th minute for a few minutes so that we all are in same page? Its highly possible I oversimplified and missed some key elements since I listened to this episode a while back.
  - thenewnewguy 7y ago
    Hi, not the original poster here but someone familiar with California's justice system. I went ahead and listened for a bit to what the podcast and its guest had to say. Your relaying of the podcast, while a little simplified, is not the problem - there aren't "key elements" missing. The problem is that the information on the podcast is blatantly wrong.
    - vishnu_ks 7y ago
      Okay. Thank you for the confirmation.

hn_throwaway_99 7y ago

The article specifically stated the law would only apply to those felons no longer on parole or probation.

vishnu_ks 7y ago
I am not taking about Parole or Probation. Time sentenced in certain jails or prisons would be counted as 2x or 3x more the time served. So cases are often delayed by the lawyers so that felons stay in these jails longer and can come out early. The podcast has more details. I am myself not well versed with the exact terminology. Updated my original comment for clarity

NeedMoreTea 7y ago

What you call "loopholes" are thankfully a standard part of most justice systems, by design. It's called parole, sometimes released on licence. First you have to get past the parole board who will assess your suitability for release. The theory is to grant you supervised access back to society to regain your place in society. While on parole there's all sorts of reason you can find yourself back inside. Half or two thirds of sentence is pretty common too. What America does different is not having post sentence - that's post release and parole - rehabilitation, you are always an ex-felon, even after 50 years law abiding. Other nations find offenders can often reform and regain a place in society, particularly if given a fair chance...

vishnu_ks 7y ago
I am not taking about Parole or Probation. Time sentenced in certain jails or prisons would be counted as 2x or 3x more the time served. So cases are often delayed by the lawyers so that felons stay in these jails longer and can come out early. The podcast has more details. I am myself not well versed with the exact terminology. Updated my original comment for clarity.
- gamblor956 7y ago
  I'm not going to reply to all of your follow-up comments, but it simply isn't possible to get 2x or 3x time served based on where you serve your sentence. The 2x time served is a good conduct credit equal to one day of conduct credit for every day served on good behavior. If you misbehave or commit further crimes in jail or prison, you don't get the credit. Violent felons get significantly less credit for good behavior (15%) and murderers aren't even eligible.

gamblor956 7y ago

The "anonymous officer" is misstating the way the rules actually work to the point of basically lying about them. (Actual rules: http://www.courts.ca.gov/partners/documents/CalculatingCustodyCredits.pdf http://www.courts.ca.gov/partners/documents/CalculatingCusto...) Custody credits. For crimes committed after October 2011, defendants who do not misbehave while in jail will receive 1 day of "conduct credits" for every 1 days of actual jail time served. Felons will similarly receive 1 day of conduct credit for every day of actual time served in prison while on good behavior. However, felons convicted of a violent crime only receive 15% conduct credit for time served (so 1 day of "conduct credit" for every 15 days of jail time served) and 0% credit if convicted of murder. The only crimes you can (or could) receive 30+ year sentences for in CA are violent crimes (like rape, armed robbery, or murder) or 3-strikes sentences, and such sentencing is no longer possible for a 3rd strike unless the 3rd strike is a violent crime. So lawyers game this so that the felons stay in these prisons/jails longer than other prisons and come out faster. The police officer is lying. Credits are based on statutory formulas and no facility provides any more custody credits than any other, because the facility doesn't determine how many credits you get.

vishnu_ks 7y ago
Can you listen to the podcast from 12th minute for a few minutes so that we all are in same page? Its highly possible I oversimplified and missed some key elements since I listened to this episode a while back.
- thenewnewguy 7y ago
  Hi, not the original poster here but someone familiar with California's justice system. I went ahead and listened for a bit to what the podcast and its guest had to say. Your relaying of the podcast, while a little simplified, is not the problem - there aren't "key elements" missing. The problem is that the information on the podcast is blatantly wrong.
  - vishnu_ks 7y ago
    Okay. Thank you for the confirmation.