4 ms·

Don't know about Page and Brin, but according to the Netflix documentary Gates won state-level math Olympiad at a level three grades higher than his own. So he

Don't know about Page and Brin, but according to the Netflix documentary Gates won state-level math Olympiad at a level three grades higher than his own. So he wasn't a modal child. You can't draw any conclusions from that about education at scale.

kick 7y ago
You actually can: if he had a better level of education than everyone else, why wouldn't he do better than people taking traditional educational paths? As someone who participated in many academic competitions as a child, the winners were consistently weighted 9:1 private:public.
- coffeemug 7y ago
  No, you cannot. IQ is highly correlated with wealth and is also highly heritable. So in all likelihood what you've observed is that smart kids win academic competitions, and also happen to be from rich families. If you take a bunch of kids with an IQ of 100 (or 115, or even 130) and put them into private schools they'll do a little better but they won't be winning any academic competitions.
  - kick 7y ago
    The available data disagrees with you on this: https://doi.org/10.1126/science.1238041 https://doi.org/10.1126/science.1238041
    - retsibsi 7y ago
      > The available data disagrees with you on this: > https://doi.org/10.1126/science.1238041 https://doi.org/10.1126/science.1238041 That article doesn't seem relevant. 'Poverty impedes cognitive function' is entirely compatible with 'IQ is highly correlated with wealth and is also highly heritable', and with the claim that private school can't make a genius out of a kid who lacks an extremely high IQ. edit: maybe I misunderstood, and you only were only pointing out that some potential-genius kids have that potential stifled by poverty. But that doesn't seem to be the original point of disagreement.
    - SamReidHughes 7y ago
      Some information about the flaws with that data: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/259207757_Comment_on_Poverty_Impedes_Cognitive_Function https://www.researchgate.net/publication/259207757_Comment_o...
- SamReidHughes 7y ago
  Let's see: https://www.maa.org/sites/default/files/pdf/AMC/usamo/2019/2019%20USAMO%20IDs.pdf https://www.maa.org/sites/default/files/pdf/AMC/usamo/2019/2... On the first page, the breakdown is 23 kids from public schools, 7 kids from private schools, 4 kids listing some sort of math circle / whatever Arateem is, 5 kids listing universities (home schooled/taking uni courses? No idea). Possibly a few of the private school kids are on scholarship. The 7 kids go to 4 schools.

kick 7y ago

You actually can: if he had a better level of education than everyone else, why wouldn't he do better than people taking traditional educational paths? As someone who participated in many academic competitions as a child, the winners were consistently weighted 9:1 private:public.

coffeemug 7y ago
No, you cannot. IQ is highly correlated with wealth and is also highly heritable. So in all likelihood what you've observed is that smart kids win academic competitions, and also happen to be from rich families. If you take a bunch of kids with an IQ of 100 (or 115, or even 130) and put them into private schools they'll do a little better but they won't be winning any academic competitions.
- kick 7y ago
  The available data disagrees with you on this: https://doi.org/10.1126/science.1238041 https://doi.org/10.1126/science.1238041
  - retsibsi 7y ago
    > The available data disagrees with you on this: > https://doi.org/10.1126/science.1238041 https://doi.org/10.1126/science.1238041 That article doesn't seem relevant. 'Poverty impedes cognitive function' is entirely compatible with 'IQ is highly correlated with wealth and is also highly heritable', and with the claim that private school can't make a genius out of a kid who lacks an extremely high IQ. edit: maybe I misunderstood, and you only were only pointing out that some potential-genius kids have that potential stifled by poverty. But that doesn't seem to be the original point of disagreement.
  - SamReidHughes 7y ago
    Some information about the flaws with that data: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/259207757_Comment_on_Poverty_Impedes_Cognitive_Function https://www.researchgate.net/publication/259207757_Comment_o...
SamReidHughes 7y ago
Let's see: https://www.maa.org/sites/default/files/pdf/AMC/usamo/2019/2019%20USAMO%20IDs.pdf https://www.maa.org/sites/default/files/pdf/AMC/usamo/2019/2... On the first page, the breakdown is 23 kids from public schools, 7 kids from private schools, 4 kids listing some sort of math circle / whatever Arateem is, 5 kids listing universities (home schooled/taking uni courses? No idea). Possibly a few of the private school kids are on scholarship. The 7 kids go to 4 schools.