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Low margin businesses fundamentally operate by exploiting low paid workers. What's wrong with making the playing field even by taxing them? The prices of food w

Low margin businesses fundamentally operate by exploiting low paid workers. What's wrong with making the playing field even by taxing them? The prices of food will go up, but that's okay. We do it here in Australia and nobody is crying over having to pay 12 AUD for McDonald's vs 9 AUD in the US.

scarface74 7y ago
Low margin businesses are also franchise owners and mom and pop shops. Who do you think is hurt the most if prices go up on fast food and at Walmart?
- ShinTakuya 7y ago
  You think the countries with minimum wages don't have these mom and pop shops? Hint: I live in such a country, and they're doing just fine. The prices are higher across the board, including the prices they sell their products for. The margin shifts, it doesn't disappear.
  - scarface74 7y ago
    I bet your country also has universal healthcare and a better safety net.
    - ShinTakuya 7y ago
      Sure, and there's nothing stopping your country from doing the same. I mean healthcare is basically irrelevant since minimum wage workers can't afford to look after health conditions regardless of whether or not they have a job. Regardless, there's no observed correlation between minimum wage and unemployment if that's what you're getting at.
      - scarface74 7y ago
        Well, the unemployment rate in most European countries is twice that of the US....
        ShinTakuya 7y ago
        What about all the many years before 2014 that the US unemployment rate was significantly more than almost all of the European countries? Did the lack of minimum wage help in 2010 when the unemployment rate was 10%? Also, that's a flat out lie. Greece, Spain, and Italy are pulling up the average with their huge unemployment rates, and the vast majority of unemployment rates besides that are almost the same as the US and in some cases lower.
        scarface74 7y ago
        Every country in the EU has a higher rate than the EU. https://www.statista.com/statistics/268830/unemployment-rate-in-eu-countries/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/268830/unemployment-rate...
        ShinTakuya 7y ago
        I'm assuming you mean than the US. The Netherlands, Hungary, Poland, Malta, Germany and Czech Republic aren't in the EU? Last time I checked they were. Germany and the Netherlands have some of the highest minimum wages in the world, and yet they have unemployment rates that are lower than the US. Moreover, your claim was that most of the countries have twice the unemployment rate of the US. Your very own source shows that only 5 of the 28 nations have double or more, and less than half have an unemployment rate 50% greater than the US. Are you going to admit to your lie or are you going to change the story?
        deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
BurningFrog 7y ago
> What's wrong with making the playing field even by taxing them? This turns the low paid workers into unemployed workers. I'm fascinated that people honestly think it's better that people make $0/h than $10/h while "exploited".
- ShinTakuya 7y ago
  Yes according to classical economics it'd result in a decrease in demand. But the reality is that these shops need the workers regardless. Moreover with a minimum wage people have more disposable income to spend at these shops, which can sometimes create more jobs than the increased salary destroyed. Most studies that have been done on minimum wage found no correlation to unemployment rate. The economics you learned in high school can rarely be applied perfectly to reality. There are plenty of countries with minimum wages with no significantly different unemployment rates in the service industries.
  - BurningFrog 7y ago
    Pretty much all changes in minimum wages are small. This makes it very hard to measure the effect with any precision. You have to remember that wages are not 100% of the compensation for employees. So if MW increases from $10 to $10:50, fringe benefits may be cut from $2 to $1:50, and you end up with no measurable effect. > But the reality is that these shops need the workers regardless. If their expenses become higher than their earnings, the shops will close. Maybe that at least is an economic fact we can agree on?
    - ShinTakuya 7y ago
      Then why not implement it that way? Make the minimum wage small and bump it up a bit ahead of inflation every year. If things go south (this hasn't happened in any other country that has done it) it can always be reversed. For what it's worth, here in Australia there's only around 10% less McDonald's stores per capita to the US, despite a $20 minimum wage. All these workers can afford to eat and live in some of the most expensive cities in the world and the country isn't collapsing under unemployment.

scarface74 7y ago

Low margin businesses are also franchise owners and mom and pop shops. Who do you think is hurt the most if prices go up on fast food and at Walmart?

ShinTakuya 7y ago
You think the countries with minimum wages don't have these mom and pop shops? Hint: I live in such a country, and they're doing just fine. The prices are higher across the board, including the prices they sell their products for. The margin shifts, it doesn't disappear.
- scarface74 7y ago
  I bet your country also has universal healthcare and a better safety net.
  - ShinTakuya 7y ago
    Sure, and there's nothing stopping your country from doing the same. I mean healthcare is basically irrelevant since minimum wage workers can't afford to look after health conditions regardless of whether or not they have a job. Regardless, there's no observed correlation between minimum wage and unemployment if that's what you're getting at.
    - scarface74 7y ago
      Well, the unemployment rate in most European countries is twice that of the US....
      - ShinTakuya 7y ago
        What about all the many years before 2014 that the US unemployment rate was significantly more than almost all of the European countries? Did the lack of minimum wage help in 2010 when the unemployment rate was 10%? Also, that's a flat out lie. Greece, Spain, and Italy are pulling up the average with their huge unemployment rates, and the vast majority of unemployment rates besides that are almost the same as the US and in some cases lower.
        scarface74 7y ago
        Every country in the EU has a higher rate than the EU. https://www.statista.com/statistics/268830/unemployment-rate-in-eu-countries/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/268830/unemployment-rate...
        ShinTakuya 7y ago
        I'm assuming you mean than the US. The Netherlands, Hungary, Poland, Malta, Germany and Czech Republic aren't in the EU? Last time I checked they were. Germany and the Netherlands have some of the highest minimum wages in the world, and yet they have unemployment rates that are lower than the US. Moreover, your claim was that most of the countries have twice the unemployment rate of the US. Your very own source shows that only 5 of the 28 nations have double or more, and less than half have an unemployment rate 50% greater than the US. Are you going to admit to your lie or are you going to change the story?
      - deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]

BurningFrog 7y ago

> What's wrong with making the playing field even by taxing them? This turns the low paid workers into unemployed workers. I'm fascinated that people honestly think it's better that people make $0/h than $10/h while "exploited".

ShinTakuya 7y ago
Yes according to classical economics it'd result in a decrease in demand. But the reality is that these shops need the workers regardless. Moreover with a minimum wage people have more disposable income to spend at these shops, which can sometimes create more jobs than the increased salary destroyed. Most studies that have been done on minimum wage found no correlation to unemployment rate. The economics you learned in high school can rarely be applied perfectly to reality. There are plenty of countries with minimum wages with no significantly different unemployment rates in the service industries.
- BurningFrog 7y ago
  Pretty much all changes in minimum wages are small. This makes it very hard to measure the effect with any precision. You have to remember that wages are not 100% of the compensation for employees. So if MW increases from $10 to $10:50, fringe benefits may be cut from $2 to $1:50, and you end up with no measurable effect. > But the reality is that these shops need the workers regardless. If their expenses become higher than their earnings, the shops will close. Maybe that at least is an economic fact we can agree on?
  - ShinTakuya 7y ago
    Then why not implement it that way? Make the minimum wage small and bump it up a bit ahead of inflation every year. If things go south (this hasn't happened in any other country that has done it) it can always be reversed. For what it's worth, here in Australia there's only around 10% less McDonald's stores per capita to the US, despite a $20 minimum wage. All these workers can afford to eat and live in some of the most expensive cities in the world and the country isn't collapsing under unemployment.