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Here in California, insanely high levels of mercury have been found in cougars and mountain lions in the mountains between Santa Cruz and the Bay Area. Current

Here in California, insanely high levels of mercury have been found in cougars and mountain lions in the mountains between Santa Cruz and the Bay Area. Current research shows the fog has been picking up mercury from the ocean and delivery to our doorstep. I liked the infographic in this article: https://www.sfchronicle.com/environment/article/Fog-brings-poison-mercury-to-Santa-Cruz-Mountains-14862445.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/environment/article/Fog-brings-p... I think one of the problems is even with tough regulation that we have here in California, it's hard to control the actions of all individuals. We have "spare the air days" and half my neighbors houses still have smoke coming out of their chimneys on those days because they use wood to heat their homes. You can narc them out and report them however the current workaround is for them to claim it's backyard pizza ovens as there is a loophole for cooking food. When I leave for work in the morning or come home at night and see all the smoke rising laugh to myself that everyone we live nearby is having a massive backyard pizza party and we are not invited! :( There's also this ridiculously persistent anti electric vehicle roll coal trend happening right now on Tik Tok and platforms where the current fox tag objective a lot of people play on CB radios is to bag a Tesla - benchmark used to be to bag a Prius. I only know about this mainly because my old coworker commuted from Placerville to San Mateo and was obsessed with playing fox tag on his commutes (which would make sense if you're a mega commuter trying to stay awake so making up dumb nicknames with your friends and all keeping each other awake on your CB radios and talking as you drive sounds fun to you). Anyways... I've just sort of internalized the fact that more and more nonsmokers here are all going to die of lung cancer and hopefully the research and cell therapy trials will get there first before I and my family go out. :(

creddit 7y ago
> There's also this ridiculously persistent anti electric vehicle roll coal trend happening right now on Tik Tok and platforms where the current fox tag objective a lot of people play on CB radios is to bag a Tesla - benchmark used to be to bag a Prius. I only know about this mainly because my old coworker commuted from Placerville to San Mateo and was obsessed with playing fox tag on his commutes (which would make sense if you're a mega commuter trying to stay awake so making up dumb nicknames with your friends and all keeping each other awake on your CB radios and talking as you drive sounds fun to you). I don't really understand what this is. What do "fox tag" and "roll coal" mean?
- js2 7y ago
  You can't believe how selfish and awful people can be till you see it in person, but: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal
- runako 7y ago
  I don't know "fox tag" but here's rolling coal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal
- MereInterest 7y ago
  Uncertain about "fox tag", but to "roll coal" is to intentionally bork up the emissions of your car, leaving a black cloud of smoke and stench behind one's car. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal
- oftenwrong 7y ago
  This is "rolling coal": https://youtube.com/watch?v=ZdDxjge5hmY https://youtube.com/watch?v=ZdDxjge5hmY https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2014/07/rolling-coal-conservatives-who-show-their-annoyance-with-liberals-obama-and-the-epa-by-blowing-black-smoke-from-their-trucks.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2014/07/rolling-coal-con... https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environment/rolling-coal-in-diesel-trucks-to-rebel-and-provoke.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environme...
paulcnichols 7y ago
Re Mercury, on the San Jose side isn't there an old Mercury mine (Almaden Quicksilver Park). I'm not saying the fog doesn't carry anything bad but I think the region has a history too.
- bproven 7y ago
  Yes, there is. It was a afaik Superfund site before it was a park.
  - hammock 7y ago
    Pretty much the entire South Bay is a Superfund site.
apta 7y ago
> There's also this ridiculously persistent anti electric vehicle I'm all for working toward better air quality, and electric vehicles definitely reduce greenhouse (and other) gas emissions. At the same time, pollution from cars is not just from exhaust emissions due to combustion. I recall reading somewhere that 80% or more of particulate matter pollution from cars comes from tires and brakes. So the notion of replacing all combustion engine cars with electric cars will somehow solve the pollution issue is not realistic. The Tesla Cybertruck might be a great vehicle, but it's heavy (large tires and lots of break wear). We need better solutions.
- fignews 7y ago
  EVs have regenerative braking. Brake pads last the life of the vehicle.
  - thisisnico 7y ago
    EV's are harder on tires though because of the weight, does it balance out?
    - ricw 7y ago
      Minutely so. Tesla’s model 3 is 200kg (~400 pounds) heavier than BMWs equivalent 3 series. Don’t think the tire wear due to that difference will make much of a difference...
      - OnlineGladiator 7y ago
        400 pounds is a lot, that's more than 10%. The degradation is almost certainly not linear. There is an old study, which admittedly has its flaws, showing road damage was proportional to the fourth (!!!) power of the weight. I don't believe it's that bad (there are very specific conditions for that study and also it does not directly translate to tire wear), but I'd imagine it's at least to the second power, making a roughly 25% difference using your example vehicles. If someone knows more precise math, please share.
volkl48 7y ago
I think most of the things you mention are minor fringe activities unlikely to be more than a rounding error in overall pollution. I can't find an exact % for how many people in CA heat with wood, but it looks to be <3%. It could be much higher for you locally if you live in a rural area, but for state-wide pollution, I think it's mostly irrelevant. That doesn't make them good (for places with pollution issues, wood isn't entirely bad as an energy source) or things to encourage, but I don't know that they're worth focusing on on either. ---------- The reason cited by the article for worsening air quality in the West is wildfires.
- stevenwoo 7y ago
  I spend a lot of time in the semi rural areas outside of San Jose/San Francisco and out of fire season in the cold months the smell of burning wood is persistent until temps get well out of the 60's (given the number of valleys/mountains, lots of areas stay cold all day in the shade/fog zone once it gets cold). Even if it's a small percentage, the odor is omnipresent, so the particulate pollution is present to some extent as well from a non scientific sampling. Wood burning (not even special low pollution devices) is not permitted in new construction in the Bay Area because of how much effect even a small percentage of homes can have on air quality.
  - labawi 7y ago
    Wood burning is a pollution problem only when burned incompletely i.e. improperly. Unfortunately, properly burning solid fuel for home heating is not typical.
nostrademons 7y ago
"Here in California, insanely high levels of mercury have been found in cougars and mountain lions in the mountains between Santa Cruz and the Bay Area" That area is on top of a mercury mine - there's a reason it's called "Almaden Quicksilver County Park", because the primary economic activity before it became a preserve was mercury mining. The southern Santa Cruz mountains sits on top of a massive mercury deposit. I'd really like to see the evidence that it's because of the fog. When you have pervasive elevated mercury levels throughout the food chain in an area that's a natural mercury deposit, the obvious explanation is that animals, plants, and fungi are picking it up from the soil, rather than it's being wafted in through the fog. (Mercury is quite heavy and isn't soluble in water, so the idea that the fog somehow wafts it in strikes me as bullshit.)
- panzagl 7y ago
  Don't you see, it goes from the fog to the animals to the ground, man.
- kaikai 7y ago
  The researchers measured mercury levels in the fog, specifically. Almaden is also on the other side of the mountains from Santa Cruz.

creddit 7y ago

> There's also this ridiculously persistent anti electric vehicle roll coal trend happening right now on Tik Tok and platforms where the current fox tag objective a lot of people play on CB radios is to bag a Tesla - benchmark used to be to bag a Prius. I only know about this mainly because my old coworker commuted from Placerville to San Mateo and was obsessed with playing fox tag on his commutes (which would make sense if you're a mega commuter trying to stay awake so making up dumb nicknames with your friends and all keeping each other awake on your CB radios and talking as you drive sounds fun to you). I don't really understand what this is. What do "fox tag" and "roll coal" mean?

js2 7y ago
You can't believe how selfish and awful people can be till you see it in person, but: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal
runako 7y ago
I don't know "fox tag" but here's rolling coal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal
MereInterest 7y ago
Uncertain about "fox tag", but to "roll coal" is to intentionally bork up the emissions of your car, leaving a black cloud of smoke and stench behind one's car. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal
oftenwrong 7y ago
This is "rolling coal": https://youtube.com/watch?v=ZdDxjge5hmY https://youtube.com/watch?v=ZdDxjge5hmY https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2014/07/rolling-coal-conservatives-who-show-their-annoyance-with-liberals-obama-and-the-epa-by-blowing-black-smoke-from-their-trucks.html https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2014/07/rolling-coal-con... https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environment/rolling-coal-in-diesel-trucks-to-rebel-and-provoke.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environme...

paulcnichols 7y ago

Re Mercury, on the San Jose side isn't there an old Mercury mine (Almaden Quicksilver Park). I'm not saying the fog doesn't carry anything bad but I think the region has a history too.

bproven 7y ago
Yes, there is. It was a afaik Superfund site before it was a park.
- hammock 7y ago
  Pretty much the entire South Bay is a Superfund site.

apta 7y ago

> There's also this ridiculously persistent anti electric vehicle I'm all for working toward better air quality, and electric vehicles definitely reduce greenhouse (and other) gas emissions. At the same time, pollution from cars is not just from exhaust emissions due to combustion. I recall reading somewhere that 80% or more of particulate matter pollution from cars comes from tires and brakes. So the notion of replacing all combustion engine cars with electric cars will somehow solve the pollution issue is not realistic. The Tesla Cybertruck might be a great vehicle, but it's heavy (large tires and lots of break wear). We need better solutions.

fignews 7y ago
EVs have regenerative braking. Brake pads last the life of the vehicle.
- thisisnico 7y ago
  EV's are harder on tires though because of the weight, does it balance out?
  - ricw 7y ago
    Minutely so. Tesla’s model 3 is 200kg (~400 pounds) heavier than BMWs equivalent 3 series. Don’t think the tire wear due to that difference will make much of a difference...
    - OnlineGladiator 7y ago
      400 pounds is a lot, that's more than 10%. The degradation is almost certainly not linear. There is an old study, which admittedly has its flaws, showing road damage was proportional to the fourth (!!!) power of the weight. I don't believe it's that bad (there are very specific conditions for that study and also it does not directly translate to tire wear), but I'd imagine it's at least to the second power, making a roughly 25% difference using your example vehicles. If someone knows more precise math, please share.

volkl48 7y ago

I think most of the things you mention are minor fringe activities unlikely to be more than a rounding error in overall pollution. I can't find an exact % for how many people in CA heat with wood, but it looks to be <3%. It could be much higher for you locally if you live in a rural area, but for state-wide pollution, I think it's mostly irrelevant. That doesn't make them good (for places with pollution issues, wood isn't entirely bad as an energy source) or things to encourage, but I don't know that they're worth focusing on on either. ---------- The reason cited by the article for worsening air quality in the West is wildfires.

stevenwoo 7y ago
I spend a lot of time in the semi rural areas outside of San Jose/San Francisco and out of fire season in the cold months the smell of burning wood is persistent until temps get well out of the 60's (given the number of valleys/mountains, lots of areas stay cold all day in the shade/fog zone once it gets cold). Even if it's a small percentage, the odor is omnipresent, so the particulate pollution is present to some extent as well from a non scientific sampling. Wood burning (not even special low pollution devices) is not permitted in new construction in the Bay Area because of how much effect even a small percentage of homes can have on air quality.
- labawi 7y ago
  Wood burning is a pollution problem only when burned incompletely i.e. improperly. Unfortunately, properly burning solid fuel for home heating is not typical.

nostrademons 7y ago

"Here in California, insanely high levels of mercury have been found in cougars and mountain lions in the mountains between Santa Cruz and the Bay Area" That area is on top of a mercury mine - there's a reason it's called "Almaden Quicksilver County Park", because the primary economic activity before it became a preserve was mercury mining. The southern Santa Cruz mountains sits on top of a massive mercury deposit. I'd really like to see the evidence that it's because of the fog. When you have pervasive elevated mercury levels throughout the food chain in an area that's a natural mercury deposit, the obvious explanation is that animals, plants, and fungi are picking it up from the soil, rather than it's being wafted in through the fog. (Mercury is quite heavy and isn't soluble in water, so the idea that the fog somehow wafts it in strikes me as bullshit.)

panzagl 7y ago
Don't you see, it goes from the fog to the animals to the ground, man.
kaikai 7y ago
The researchers measured mercury levels in the fog, specifically. Almaden is also on the other side of the mountains from Santa Cruz.