7 ms·

You have no obligation to say anything until provided with a solicitor.

chrisseaton 7y ago
You have no obligation to... but the jury can hold that against you. It seems somewhat reasonable to me - if you have an alibi then you should tell that to the Police as soon as practical. Otherwise you're wasting everyone's time.
- MereInterest 7y ago
  I am not a lawyer. I have not studied law, and do not know what comments are innocuous to make, and what comments would be used against me. I do not know what constitutes an alibi in the eyes of the law. I do not know what questions police are legally allowed to ask. It is unreasonable to expect a person to know the detailed workings of the legal system. It is therefore unreasonable for there to be any negative consequences whatsoever for waiting until there is a legal expert present.
  - chrisseaton 7y ago
    > It is therefore unreasonable for there to be any negative consequences whatsoever for waiting until there is a legal expert present. You don't need to be a legal expert to answer basic questions from a Police officer about did you do something or were you in a location at a time. They aren't lawyers either! And I didn't say you couldn't ask for a lawyer and wait for one to turn up before answering... But if they charge you for speeding, and then you wait six months until the trial, and claim only at that point that you weren't the one driving. Come on... that's a waste of society's time.
    - deleted 7y ago
      [deleted]
    - mattlutze 7y ago
      In many jurisdictions, law enforcement have gray areas as to what they can ask, how they can ask it, and how they can use your answers. Their job is to collect evidence and send it to the prosecutor. They're given wide latitude to collect it as quickly as possible, and while law enforcement and the public attorney's offices are by and large just trying to see justice done fairly, they're almost always understaffed and over-pressured. People act weird in pressure situations. Law enforcement personnel deal with law breaking every day, but the rest of us don't. If you're innocent and confronted with an accusation of a crime, in your resulting heightened emotional state, you don't want to say something stupid or in a way that makes you look unnecessarily suspicious. In this situation it should be ok for you to not answer questions, wait until your involuntary adrenaline reaction wears off, and then have a conversation about it.
      - chrisseaton 7y ago
        > In this situation it should be ok for you to not answer questions, wait until your involuntary adrenaline reaction wears off, and then have a conversation about it. I don't think it is if you know someone else committed the offence and they are still out there, potentially still offending. If you know the identity of a rapist, saying 'I'm not going to talk to the Police until convenient for me' is a rotten attitude.
    - kazagistar 7y ago
      What you say can't be used in your favor. It can only be used against you. And if you are innocent, then it's the police who are wasting society's time (though I am not sure what that means) and they can wait a bit longer when it comes to making sure justice is done properly and not incompetently rushed.
      - chrisseaton 7y ago
        > What you say can't be used in your favor. It can only be used against you. And in the UK, what you don't say can be used against you. > it may harm your defence if you do not mention when questioned something which you later rely on in court
      - Sohcahtoa82 7y ago
        > What you say can't be used in your favor. Is it accurate to say that it actually can't be used in your favor, or that it simply won't be?
    - hylaride 7y ago
      > You don't need to be a legal expert to answer basic questions from a Police officer about did you do something or were you in a location at a time. They aren't lawyers either! And I didn't say you couldn't ask for a lawyer and wait for one to turn up before answering... Wrong. In interviews, the police can (and do) lie, lead, present circumstantial evidence as smoking guns, etc. They are not lawyers, but they are well versed in the law. They are also in all probability more experienced in asking questions and interviewing than you are, even if you're smarter than them. Everything you say to the police can and will literally be used against you. When you speak, even if you're innocent, you give up the biggest advantage you have. ANY inconsistencies will be used against you. Words can be given uncharitably during trial. They police WILL ASK YOU QUESTIONS that a prosecutor WILL NOT BE ALLOWED to ask in a trial (speculation, leading, etc), but if you answer the police it can be used in a trial and will in all likelihood be recorded. Ever listen to yourself later and cringe? Yeah. Even if you present a consistent story from police interview to trial, you can't even use that consistency to your benefit, but the prosecutor can use the inconsistencies against you. Your silence can't be mentioned during a trial. It cannot be used against you. Look, if it's a speeding ticket by all means talk to the police. If saw a criminal running away, tell the police what direction they headed. If you've been detained or are in any way at risk of it, call a laywer.
      - chrisseaton 7y ago
        > If you've been detained or are in any way at risk of it, call a laywer. I didn't say don't.
        hylaride 7y ago
        The fact that you’re having to clarify your points to everybody means your wording implied otherwise.
- danShumway 7y ago
  > if you have an alibi then you should tell that to the Police as soon as practical. Do not take this advice. Talk to a lawyer. If you have an alibi, you can tell your alibi to a lawyer, and your lawyer can communicate your alibi to the police before you go to trial. You won't be wasting anyone's time, you'll just be giving the police the same evidence through someone who is trained to talk to police officers, and isn't going to accidentally say something that's misinterpreted or twisted to turn your life into a nightmare. If you are being suspected of a crime, it doesn't matter if you're innocent -- the police are not your friends.
  - chrisseaton 7y ago
    I didn't say don't talk to a lawyer first. You've imagined that part. It is a fact full stop that a jury can hold it against you if you unreasonably delay giving important information - it's not my opinion.
    - dbdjfjrjvebd 7y ago
      Except in a very few cases related to terror or fraud or being at the border you have a right to a solicitor before answering questiins. Furthermore if the police don't allow you one then they would be breaking the law.
      - chrisseaton 7y ago
        Ok? That doesn't contradict anything I said.
        dbdjfjrjvebd 7y ago
        The key is that asking for a solicitor is not an unreasonable delay. So the basic advice not to talk to the police holds.
    - danShumway 7y ago
      Fair enough -- I just want to stress that you should talk to the police through a lawyer. You should not sit down and talk to the police unless your lawyer is sitting directly next to you. Ideally, your lawyer should contact the police on your behalf with your alibi and you should never directly talk to them. We can't realistically keep a jury from holding that against you the same way that we can't realistically keep a jury from randomly misinterpreting the law, or convicting someone just because they're black -- but we make it clear to them that they're really not supposed to. And the risk from talking to the police without a lawyer present is much higher than the risk of a jury punishing you for exercising your 5th Amendment rights -- you should err on trusting a jury to do the right thing more than you should err on trusting a prosecutor to do the right thing.
- dbdjfjrjvebd 7y ago
  No the jury cannot hold against you that you asked for a lawyer. In fact if you are not provided with one after asking then the police would be in violation of PACE codes and the prosecution is unlikely to even go to trial. I am not a solicitor of course.
  - chrisseaton 7y ago
    > No the jury cannot hold against you that you asked for a lawyer. Lol that isn't what I said, is it?

You have no obligation to... but the jury can hold that against you. It seems somewhat reasonable to me - if you have an alibi then you should tell that to the Police as soon as practical. Otherwise you're wasting everyone's time.

MereInterest 7y ago
I am not a lawyer. I have not studied law, and do not know what comments are innocuous to make, and what comments would be used against me. I do not know what constitutes an alibi in the eyes of the law. I do not know what questions police are legally allowed to ask. It is unreasonable to expect a person to know the detailed workings of the legal system. It is therefore unreasonable for there to be any negative consequences whatsoever for waiting until there is a legal expert present.
- chrisseaton 7y ago
  > It is therefore unreasonable for there to be any negative consequences whatsoever for waiting until there is a legal expert present. You don't need to be a legal expert to answer basic questions from a Police officer about did you do something or were you in a location at a time. They aren't lawyers either! And I didn't say you couldn't ask for a lawyer and wait for one to turn up before answering... But if they charge you for speeding, and then you wait six months until the trial, and claim only at that point that you weren't the one driving. Come on... that's a waste of society's time.
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - mattlutze 7y ago
    In many jurisdictions, law enforcement have gray areas as to what they can ask, how they can ask it, and how they can use your answers. Their job is to collect evidence and send it to the prosecutor. They're given wide latitude to collect it as quickly as possible, and while law enforcement and the public attorney's offices are by and large just trying to see justice done fairly, they're almost always understaffed and over-pressured. People act weird in pressure situations. Law enforcement personnel deal with law breaking every day, but the rest of us don't. If you're innocent and confronted with an accusation of a crime, in your resulting heightened emotional state, you don't want to say something stupid or in a way that makes you look unnecessarily suspicious. In this situation it should be ok for you to not answer questions, wait until your involuntary adrenaline reaction wears off, and then have a conversation about it.
    - chrisseaton 7y ago
      > In this situation it should be ok for you to not answer questions, wait until your involuntary adrenaline reaction wears off, and then have a conversation about it. I don't think it is if you know someone else committed the offence and they are still out there, potentially still offending. If you know the identity of a rapist, saying 'I'm not going to talk to the Police until convenient for me' is a rotten attitude.
  - kazagistar 7y ago
    What you say can't be used in your favor. It can only be used against you. And if you are innocent, then it's the police who are wasting society's time (though I am not sure what that means) and they can wait a bit longer when it comes to making sure justice is done properly and not incompetently rushed.
    - chrisseaton 7y ago
      > What you say can't be used in your favor. It can only be used against you. And in the UK, what you don't say can be used against you. > it may harm your defence if you do not mention when questioned something which you later rely on in court
    - Sohcahtoa82 7y ago
      > What you say can't be used in your favor. Is it accurate to say that it actually can't be used in your favor, or that it simply won't be?
  - hylaride 7y ago
    > You don't need to be a legal expert to answer basic questions from a Police officer about did you do something or were you in a location at a time. They aren't lawyers either! And I didn't say you couldn't ask for a lawyer and wait for one to turn up before answering... Wrong. In interviews, the police can (and do) lie, lead, present circumstantial evidence as smoking guns, etc. They are not lawyers, but they are well versed in the law. They are also in all probability more experienced in asking questions and interviewing than you are, even if you're smarter than them. Everything you say to the police can and will literally be used against you. When you speak, even if you're innocent, you give up the biggest advantage you have. ANY inconsistencies will be used against you. Words can be given uncharitably during trial. They police WILL ASK YOU QUESTIONS that a prosecutor WILL NOT BE ALLOWED to ask in a trial (speculation, leading, etc), but if you answer the police it can be used in a trial and will in all likelihood be recorded. Ever listen to yourself later and cringe? Yeah. Even if you present a consistent story from police interview to trial, you can't even use that consistency to your benefit, but the prosecutor can use the inconsistencies against you. Your silence can't be mentioned during a trial. It cannot be used against you. Look, if it's a speeding ticket by all means talk to the police. If saw a criminal running away, tell the police what direction they headed. If you've been detained or are in any way at risk of it, call a laywer.
    - chrisseaton 7y ago
      > If you've been detained or are in any way at risk of it, call a laywer. I didn't say don't.
      - hylaride 7y ago
        The fact that you’re having to clarify your points to everybody means your wording implied otherwise.
danShumway 7y ago
> if you have an alibi then you should tell that to the Police as soon as practical. Do not take this advice. Talk to a lawyer. If you have an alibi, you can tell your alibi to a lawyer, and your lawyer can communicate your alibi to the police before you go to trial. You won't be wasting anyone's time, you'll just be giving the police the same evidence through someone who is trained to talk to police officers, and isn't going to accidentally say something that's misinterpreted or twisted to turn your life into a nightmare. If you are being suspected of a crime, it doesn't matter if you're innocent -- the police are not your friends.
- chrisseaton 7y ago
  I didn't say don't talk to a lawyer first. You've imagined that part. It is a fact full stop that a jury can hold it against you if you unreasonably delay giving important information - it's not my opinion.
  - dbdjfjrjvebd 7y ago
    Except in a very few cases related to terror or fraud or being at the border you have a right to a solicitor before answering questiins. Furthermore if the police don't allow you one then they would be breaking the law.
    - chrisseaton 7y ago
      Ok? That doesn't contradict anything I said.
      - dbdjfjrjvebd 7y ago
        The key is that asking for a solicitor is not an unreasonable delay. So the basic advice not to talk to the police holds.
  - danShumway 7y ago
    Fair enough -- I just want to stress that you should talk to the police through a lawyer. You should not sit down and talk to the police unless your lawyer is sitting directly next to you. Ideally, your lawyer should contact the police on your behalf with your alibi and you should never directly talk to them. We can't realistically keep a jury from holding that against you the same way that we can't realistically keep a jury from randomly misinterpreting the law, or convicting someone just because they're black -- but we make it clear to them that they're really not supposed to. And the risk from talking to the police without a lawyer present is much higher than the risk of a jury punishing you for exercising your 5th Amendment rights -- you should err on trusting a jury to do the right thing more than you should err on trusting a prosecutor to do the right thing.
dbdjfjrjvebd 7y ago
No the jury cannot hold against you that you asked for a lawyer. In fact if you are not provided with one after asking then the police would be in violation of PACE codes and the prosecution is unlikely to even go to trial. I am not a solicitor of course.
- chrisseaton 7y ago
  > No the jury cannot hold against you that you asked for a lawyer. Lol that isn't what I said, is it?