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Obligatory link to "Don't Talk To The Police" => https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE It's a ~47 video, and

Obligatory link to "Don't Talk To The Police" => https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE It's a ~47 video, and even if you don't agree with the conclusion, I think it's excellent. I haven't adopted a "never talk to the police" vibe, but I seriously think twice about talking to cops for anything that matters. For example, if shady person running down street with purse, person yelling "that person grabbed my purse", and cop asks "did you see which way the purse snatcher ran", I'll probably speak up :) . Cop asks me where I was last Saturday night, I'm not inclined to start volunteering information.

wusel 7y ago
The lawyer (James Duane) actually changed his stance on this. There is an updated version of this video somewhere.
- mkl 7y ago
  Is it this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IO7z4cHrcuY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IO7z4cHrcuY It's from last year, and the description suggests it's not like you are saying. (I haven't watched it; it's an hour and a half long.)
  - PopeDotNinja 7y ago
    Thanks for linking. Will watch later.
  - wusel 7y ago
    That wasn't the one I was thinking of, but it's essentially the same. He is just less absolute about it.
- goblin89 7y ago
  Not sure about a new video of James Duane, but there’s a relatively recent write-up[0]. His advice generally stands, but with caveats: — To prevent invoking the 5th from seeming as admission of guilt to jurors and to the public, it may be safer to invoke the right to counsel instead and refuse to talk without your lawyer present. — In case of traffic stops invoking the 5th may be overkill and polite talk may be productive, unless body or car search (or canine sniffing) is involved. [0] https://www.wglt.org/post/when-not-talk-police https://www.wglt.org/post/when-not-talk-police
  - deleted 7y ago
    [deleted]
  - philg_jr 7y ago
    > — In case of traffic stops invoking the 5th may be overkill and polite talk may be productive, unless body or car search (or canine sniffing) is involved. Agreed. Being polite is 100% the way to go, even if the officer is being a jerk. Many of them want to get a reaction out of you. Best thing to do is to roll down your window all the way, turn the lights on in the car, keep your hands on the steering wheel, and always use sir or ma'am when responding to them. Ask for permission to do anything. I've had good luck being polite and pleading either ignorance or stupidness, depending on what the violation is. Generally, never argue, and just challenge the violation in court. If its bad, get a lawyer specializing in traffic violations. If its minor, calling the officer and trying to set up a face-to-face meeting to ask if there is anything he can do to minimize the points to avoid any insurance increases has worked for me many times. If you never get a hold of the officer, getting to your hearing early to speak with the him/her (politely) has worked for me as well. The rule of thumb is always be polite. If you are getting arrested, be polite and keep your mouth shut and get a lawyer when you can. Note, I don't have much sympathy for anyone who truly drives like a a-hole for no reason. But some of us have cars that are fun to drive, when the time is right of course. IANAL, obviously, just my experience.
    - __s 7y ago
      Your 100% may vary based on the color of your skin
    - kazagistar 7y ago
      Basically, remember that since all cops are bastards, if you feed their egos enough (and are white) they will be more likely to let you off the hook for minor crimes in a toxic cronist sort of way.
      - logfromblammo 7y ago
        1. Be polite. 2. Be white, if possible. 2a. If it is impossible or impractical for you to be white, instead use your "Sorry For Bothering You" "white voice". 3. Roll d100 and consult Table 22: Cop Bastardliness Levels, to determine difficulty classes for your Persuade and Bluff checks. Good luck! It's always best to just avoid all police encounters in the US. If you routinely drive in excess of posted limits, use radar detectors and crowdsourced speed trap warning apps. Tint your windows to the legal limit, and no darker. Ensure your signal lamps are all functional, and signal all turns and lane changes. Come to a full stop behind the line at all stop signs and red traffic lights. If you see a uniformed cop in public, do not approach. Be somewhere else, as quickly as you can manage, but without appearing too suspicious. In any situation in which you might think it would be okay to deal with police directly, you're probably wrong, unless someone is literally in mortal peril already. Instead contact your lawyer, or security contractor, or insurance adjuster, or psychiatrist. In most cases, the police have no legal obligation to help you, and legally unchecked power to harm you, so why risk it?
faeyanpiraat 7y ago
This video has some great advice, also his speaking skills are excellent, this is even enjoyable to watch as an entertainment piece.
F147H34D 7y ago
> I haven't adopted a "never talk to the police" vibe, but I seriously think twice about talking to cops for anything that matters. I was a police officer for a good portion of my life. The problem is you may not know what matters. I have a couple teenagers and I don't even let them talk to school administrators without me present if there was some type of trouble at school. I certainly would never let my children talk to the police and I myself, would never talk to the police. You may think what you are saying sounds innocent but you never know how the officer is viewing your statement or what king of evidence they are looking for. For example, a few years ago my neighbor's house burned down in the middle of the night. He and his family had decided to spend the night elsewhere that night before the fire started. Apparently, he had some hotel points from work travel and they stayed the night at a fancy hotel -- locally. Investigators were suspicious of this so they brought him in for questioning. From his account, he said they were very friendly to him and sorry that his house had burned down. They jokingly asked if he had ever missed any payments on his house. He said actually he missed this months because of a illness in his family that required extra money. But that he had worked it out with the bank. Well the investigator ran with that statement and the fact that his whole family wasn't home and opened an arson investigation with him as the suspect. It took nearly a year to clear him and the insurance wouldn't pay until the investigation was done. He continued to pay for the house and had to live with relatives. The whole thing was crazy. If he wouldn't have talked to the police, they would have relied solely on the fire investigation report which didn't indicate arson.
- tsycho 7y ago
  So as an ex police officer, why do you think your ex colleagues did stuff like this? i.e. Intentionally twist someone's statement or lull them into a false sense of security to say something that will be intentionally misinterpreted? I know policing is just a job, but given that the impact of your actions can and often screw the lives of innocent people, with no opportunity for recourse on top of that, why do (many?) police officers not feel any responsibility to do the right thing? You don't hear of doctors and nurses being so callous in their jobs, or at least the rate of incidence seems to be orders of magnitude lower compared to law enforcement. In your opinion, what can be done to improve the system? Would making it easier to file and win lawsuits against the police/prosecution for incompetence/malpractice help? (similar to doctors)

wusel 7y ago

The lawyer (James Duane) actually changed his stance on this. There is an updated version of this video somewhere.

mkl 7y ago
Is it this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IO7z4cHrcuY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IO7z4cHrcuY It's from last year, and the description suggests it's not like you are saying. (I haven't watched it; it's an hour and a half long.)
- PopeDotNinja 7y ago
  Thanks for linking. Will watch later.
- wusel 7y ago
  That wasn't the one I was thinking of, but it's essentially the same. He is just less absolute about it.
goblin89 7y ago
Not sure about a new video of James Duane, but there’s a relatively recent write-up[0]. His advice generally stands, but with caveats: — To prevent invoking the 5th from seeming as admission of guilt to jurors and to the public, it may be safer to invoke the right to counsel instead and refuse to talk without your lawyer present. — In case of traffic stops invoking the 5th may be overkill and polite talk may be productive, unless body or car search (or canine sniffing) is involved. [0] https://www.wglt.org/post/when-not-talk-police https://www.wglt.org/post/when-not-talk-police
- deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
- philg_jr 7y ago
  > — In case of traffic stops invoking the 5th may be overkill and polite talk may be productive, unless body or car search (or canine sniffing) is involved. Agreed. Being polite is 100% the way to go, even if the officer is being a jerk. Many of them want to get a reaction out of you. Best thing to do is to roll down your window all the way, turn the lights on in the car, keep your hands on the steering wheel, and always use sir or ma'am when responding to them. Ask for permission to do anything. I've had good luck being polite and pleading either ignorance or stupidness, depending on what the violation is. Generally, never argue, and just challenge the violation in court. If its bad, get a lawyer specializing in traffic violations. If its minor, calling the officer and trying to set up a face-to-face meeting to ask if there is anything he can do to minimize the points to avoid any insurance increases has worked for me many times. If you never get a hold of the officer, getting to your hearing early to speak with the him/her (politely) has worked for me as well. The rule of thumb is always be polite. If you are getting arrested, be polite and keep your mouth shut and get a lawyer when you can. Note, I don't have much sympathy for anyone who truly drives like a a-hole for no reason. But some of us have cars that are fun to drive, when the time is right of course. IANAL, obviously, just my experience.
  - __s 7y ago
    Your 100% may vary based on the color of your skin
  - kazagistar 7y ago
    Basically, remember that since all cops are bastards, if you feed their egos enough (and are white) they will be more likely to let you off the hook for minor crimes in a toxic cronist sort of way.
    - logfromblammo 7y ago
      1. Be polite. 2. Be white, if possible. 2a. If it is impossible or impractical for you to be white, instead use your "Sorry For Bothering You" "white voice". 3. Roll d100 and consult Table 22: Cop Bastardliness Levels, to determine difficulty classes for your Persuade and Bluff checks. Good luck! It's always best to just avoid all police encounters in the US. If you routinely drive in excess of posted limits, use radar detectors and crowdsourced speed trap warning apps. Tint your windows to the legal limit, and no darker. Ensure your signal lamps are all functional, and signal all turns and lane changes. Come to a full stop behind the line at all stop signs and red traffic lights. If you see a uniformed cop in public, do not approach. Be somewhere else, as quickly as you can manage, but without appearing too suspicious. In any situation in which you might think it would be okay to deal with police directly, you're probably wrong, unless someone is literally in mortal peril already. Instead contact your lawyer, or security contractor, or insurance adjuster, or psychiatrist. In most cases, the police have no legal obligation to help you, and legally unchecked power to harm you, so why risk it?

faeyanpiraat 7y ago

This video has some great advice, also his speaking skills are excellent, this is even enjoyable to watch as an entertainment piece.

F147H34D 7y ago

> I haven't adopted a "never talk to the police" vibe, but I seriously think twice about talking to cops for anything that matters. I was a police officer for a good portion of my life. The problem is you may not know what matters. I have a couple teenagers and I don't even let them talk to school administrators without me present if there was some type of trouble at school. I certainly would never let my children talk to the police and I myself, would never talk to the police. You may think what you are saying sounds innocent but you never know how the officer is viewing your statement or what king of evidence they are looking for. For example, a few years ago my neighbor's house burned down in the middle of the night. He and his family had decided to spend the night elsewhere that night before the fire started. Apparently, he had some hotel points from work travel and they stayed the night at a fancy hotel -- locally. Investigators were suspicious of this so they brought him in for questioning. From his account, he said they were very friendly to him and sorry that his house had burned down. They jokingly asked if he had ever missed any payments on his house. He said actually he missed this months because of a illness in his family that required extra money. But that he had worked it out with the bank. Well the investigator ran with that statement and the fact that his whole family wasn't home and opened an arson investigation with him as the suspect. It took nearly a year to clear him and the insurance wouldn't pay until the investigation was done. He continued to pay for the house and had to live with relatives. The whole thing was crazy. If he wouldn't have talked to the police, they would have relied solely on the fire investigation report which didn't indicate arson.

tsycho 7y ago
So as an ex police officer, why do you think your ex colleagues did stuff like this? i.e. Intentionally twist someone's statement or lull them into a false sense of security to say something that will be intentionally misinterpreted? I know policing is just a job, but given that the impact of your actions can and often screw the lives of innocent people, with no opportunity for recourse on top of that, why do (many?) police officers not feel any responsibility to do the right thing? You don't hear of doctors and nurses being so callous in their jobs, or at least the rate of incidence seems to be orders of magnitude lower compared to law enforcement. In your opinion, what can be done to improve the system? Would making it easier to file and win lawsuits against the police/prosecution for incompetence/malpractice help? (similar to doctors)